Gosh , are we maybe just so passionate we miss what others see?

[Bill Pemberton Woodhouse]

Got the new Automobile Magazine a the Title Heading reads, " American Beauty , Part II." The tag line prior to the story is equally flattering with the comment of, "Putting a roof on the Dodge Viper SRT-10 transformed it into one of the best looking cars on the road. Just like it's predecessor. " They agreed with alot of the DC comments and I loved the bold italics highlighting the third page of the article, " It's more AGGRESSIVE - LOOKING , in line with the IMAGE, of the Viper. IT'S BOLDER. The Corvette is a little timid."

Walking around the Detroit Auto Show , I was proud to see the packed throngs in the DC area, it was fun watching the folks push to get a better view of the new Coupe, and yes the new Vette is attractive, but sometimes we need to realize what we have and be a little less aggressive with our initial assessments before we have seen the beauty in the flesh. Now don't get me wrong, I don't expect you all to become timid, that is for another Camp!

Thanks DC for listening, and giving us the opportunity to voice or concerns , thoughts, and opinions, and now that the next Snake is ready to strike, we who have seen it slithering across the stage are feeling very, very venomous.


See it and believe.

 

[Fiorano]

I think the new coupe is a good move. However, looks aside, the Z06 appears to be a better engineered car from what I've gathered.

 

[Wicked]

I have been debating on getting either the Z06 or Viper since they announced the Z06 numbers and honestly I was leaning towards the Z06. However, after going to the Auto Show last weekend, I'm more confused then ever.

There are so many arguements on which one to get and why, but today at work really put it into perspective for me. I was showing one of my employees the pictures from the auto show and he came to the Viper and knew what it was right away. I told him I either wanted to buy the Viper or the Z06, and he looked at me puzzled.. I asked him if he knew what a Z06 was and he said no.

Story short, most people have no clue what a Z06 is. To them it's just another Corvette. Mind you, just being a Corvette draws respect. However, the Viper just has a presents about it. I may be bias because I've wanted a Viper since 97, but you really just can't beat the styling. It may not be as radical as the orginal GTS, but I still love it.

Regardless what DC does to the HP, I'm going to have to stick with the coupe this fall. I know it's hard to justify the extra 10-20k on car that performs worse, but at the end of the day it's not just about performance.

That and I will absolutely NOT get into a arguement with another Corvette owner, who has a standard C6, about why he did not get the Z06 and that 400hp was plenty and the Z06 was a waste of money. While knowing full well he probably couldn't shell out the extra $20-30k on the Z06. Same arguement people had about buying a WS6/SS a few years back.

Can't wait till fall!

 

[SRTJOE]

I have been debating on getting either the Z06 or Viper since they announced the Z06 numbers and honestly I was leaning towards the Z06. However, after going to the Auto Show last weekend, I'm more confused then ever.

There are so many arguements on which one to get and why, but today at work really put it into perspective for me. I was showing one of my employees the pictures from the auto show and he came to the Viper and knew what it was right away. I told him I either wanted to buy the Viper or the Z06, and he looked at me puzzled.. I asked him if he knew what a Z06 was and he said no.

Story short, most people have no clue what a Z06 is. To them it's just another Corvette. Mind you, just being a Corvette draws respect. However, the Viper just has a presents about it. I may be bias because I've wanted a Viper since 97, but you really just can't beat the styling. It may not be as radical as the orginal GTS, but I still love it.

Regardless what DC does to the HP, I'm going to have to stick with the coupe this fall. I know it's hard to justify the extra 10-20k on car that performs worse, but at the end of the day it's not just about performance.

That and I will absolutely NOT get into a arguement with another Corvette owner, who has a standard C6, about why he did not get the Z06 and that 400hp was plenty and the Z06 was a waste of money. While knowing full well he probably couldn't shell out the extra $20-30k on the Z06. Same arguement people had about buying a WS6/SS a few years back.

Can't wait till fall!

Welcome.
quote
I know it's hard to justify the extra 10-20k on car that performs worse, but at the end of the day it's not just about performance.

All I can say is it's not over till the fat lady eats or sings or?

 

[Bill Pemberton Woodhouse]

Contrary to popular belief I actually like Vettes , but I think the criticisms of the Coupe became somewhat silly when you get to view both cars. We know more than the average automotive customer about the Coupe, but if you view it side by side the new ZO6 , you realize how well it flows. It looks more in tune with itself and it is a beautiful machine. The Vette , as a worthy competitor, was awaiting in the wings for many of us to view, and I think the analysis of some of it's design features baffled me ( and others ) more than any of the items we critiqued on the Concept when it came out. With the car costing mucho plenty, why did they put that funky cheap dark gray plastic rear brake light on the tailend? Was this supposed to also mimic a little spoiler , because if so, it doesn't even challenge some of JC Whitney's best. The grill is really attractive and I even think the funky front lights will grow on folks and be a design plus, but what in the heck were they thinking,again, with the funky gray plastic mud flap fender extentions, morphing into a quazi rear diffuser - it was such a bad execution, I was waiting for deeper flaps with reclining nudes attached to them. The wheels are spectacular, with drilled rotors and the Corvette logo all over the calipers really stands out. Things seem to be outstanding or just add ons, with the odd rear brake duct and the front fender outlet, looking like the slapped on extensions of mid 90s Mustangs - just no flow, and the door handle adds to the cut out look. The interior I personally find very becoming and pleasing to the eye, but I sure look forward to watch Chebby buns fly when going around corners, as there is some superior logic to going with suede inserts for your heinie in the Viper. I find the rear end has the perfect classic Vette style, and it looks great, until we get back to the plastic add-ons around the entire butt section. I will admit I was surprised to find the front scoop to actually be in the bumper, as I thought it was a carbon copy of the Viper, and drafted right into the hood. Not sure which choice was better, just an interesting touch to consider, not a criticism. Where this is all going is simple, it takes a side by side comparison to see the gorgeous flow of the Snake, and it makes the tranformation from ******* to fully dressed even more amazing. Two beautiful automobiles, but the hand of Ralph Gilles and crew bends towards stylistic flow of line and form, whereas the Vette addresses it's caresses with add ons and visual ques. With a female twist in the analysis, the Snake is a classic beauty , and the Chevy is stunning to many with it's ability to accessorize for effect.

 

[BobK898]

That's all great and dandy, LOL, but if the Z06 outperforms the Viper, I could give a crap if it looks better. 2 things that were tantamount to owning a Viper were its great looks and that it was King of the Road. To be in 2nd place behind a common Vette is a slap in the face, and somewhat of an embarrassment.

 

[29OUTLAW]

That's all great and dandy, LOL, but if the Z06 outperforms the Viper, I could give a crap if it looks better. 2 things that were tantamount to owning a Viper were its great looks and that it was King of the Road. To be in 2nd place behind a common Vette is a slap in the face, and somewhat of an embarrassment.

Anyone who walks around embarrassed and ashamed because he doesn’t have the most powerful car on the road really needs to re-think his priorities in life.

 

[JBenko]

Bill,

Here is the rub - One manufacturer decided to come to the table with:

Aluminum chassis
Hydroformed stainless steel exhaust headers
Titanium intake valves
Titanium connecting rods
Sodium filled exhaust valves
Carbon fiber fenders
Carbon fiber floors
Machined intake, exhaust ports and combustion chamber
Magnesium front cross member
Diff cooler
Dry sump !!!
3100 lbs !!!
$15k (est) cheaper price

And the other one came to the table with a slapped on hardtop and not a single technical or mechanical enhancement. Doesn't look like a difficult decision to me. After a minimal initial boost in sales because the coupe is new it would appear that the majority of us will be back in Lutz's camp...

 

[WANTED]

That's all great and dandy, LOL, but if the Z06 outperforms the Viper, I could give a crap if it looks better. 2 things that were tantamount to owning a Viper were its great looks and that it was King of the Road. To be in 2nd place behind a common Vette is a slap in the face, and somewhat of an embarrassment.

Anyone who walks around embarrassed and ashamed because he doesn’t have the most powerful car on the road really needs to re-think his priorities in life.

BINGO!!!!!

 

[nevrenuf]

As a short term Viper owner, after many years of Vettes, I continue to be amazed how much of this board is consumed by Z06 discussion!... www.corvetteforum.com .. membership is free...

What a waste...

 

[doctorbob]

First of all, I think that the frequency of posts on the Z06 reflect two basic facts:

1. GM has come out with a car that is directly aimed at the viper.

2. There obviously is several divergent groups involved with this website. One group is the viper owners, whether Generation 1, 2, or 3. We have varying opinions on our cars and a passion as a group for the future of the viper. There is a performance and appearance expectation associated with the car by viper owners. A second group is made up of individuals who are "enthusiasts". Their opinions and posts may or may not represent the core population of this website which are the owners.

I am sure the number of posts on the Z06 will die down as time goes by and as we see the response by SRT/DC to GM's challenge.

 

[nevrenuf]

Doctorbob..

I certainly understand.. I was just hoping that this site would provide me with what the corvette forum did.. i.e. a site to learn, ask questions, share experiences, ask about mods, vendors, etc... which so far, is completely NOT the case..

Maybe someday, once they hype dies down.....

 

[BLUESNAKE367]

doctorbob, Could not resist, but your statement sounds like good medicine to me........

 

[doctorbob]

Nevrenuf, all of those things are on this site. You just have to look or ask. As an owner, I have had five vipers from the original RT/10 without windows to my current SRT10. I think for the past month, we have seen a large number of posts on the Z06. Post about a mod or vender question and I am sure many of us will give you an answer or point you in the right direction to find the information you need.

 

[Fiorano]

Here is a quote on the new Z06 from this months Sports Car International.

"...The end result is a distinctive-looking Corvette that goes faster than almost any other street-legal car available today. Notice I didn't say faster than any car in its price range, or faster than any mass-produced car."

Looks are subjective, but preformance isn't. I won't sell my GTS for one. But I definitely will buy it over the new SRT Coupe, even if the costs were equal, which they won't be.

 

[FLYNLO]

Here is a quote on the new Z06 from this months Sports Car International.

"...The end result is a distinctive-looking Corvette that goes faster than almost any other street-legal car available today. Notice I didn't say faster than any car in its price range, or faster than any mass-produced car."

Looks are subjective, but preformance isn't. I won't sell my GTS for one. But I definitely will buy it over the new SRT Coupe, even if the costs were equal, which they won't be.

Honestly, i dont think anyone here cares if you purchase a new zo6. As a matter of fact, im sure the other 30,000 who will own one by the beginning of next year will be the ONLY ones who really care in the first place. Have fun in your "carvet". You don't deserve to own a viper.

 

[mrviper99]

I'm confused at DCX showing and marketing the SRT 10. I attended the Detroit auto show today. Went and saw the new ZO6, sharp car, they had one on the platform they had a race version next to it on the platform and then had three other cars all in different colors for people to touch and sit in an drewl over. So then cruised over to the Dodge display, to see one viper the new coupe on the platform so no one could touch or sit in it. No convertibles of different colors Red, Yellow, Black, Silver or White. What gives Dodge doesn't want to sell the cars. There must be plenty cars at Conner Ave that they could show and let possible new viper owners sit in their dream car. Lets face it the dealers won't let any one sit in the cars at the dealerships, how does anyone that hasn't bought the car get to feel what we feel when we sit inside. Dodge needs to get closer to the people with their cars so people will buy their cars.

 

[RavenFan_94]

I can't wait to see some side by side comparisons on these two cars. From what some of you guys post, the Viper might as well be a caravan. We'll see. I hope that most of you guys who post over here time and time and time and again really do buy a Vette.

 

[Fiorano]

Here is a quote on the new Z06 from this months Sports Car International.

"...The end result is a distinctive-looking Corvette that goes faster than almost any other street-legal car available today. Notice I didn't say faster than any car in its price range, or faster than any mass-produced car."

Looks are subjective, but preformance isn't. I won't sell my GTS for one. But I definitely will buy it over the new SRT Coupe, even if the costs were equal, which they won't be.

Honestly, i dont think anyone here cares if you purchase a new zo6. As a matter of fact, im sure the other 30,000 who will own one by the beginning of next year will be the ONLY ones who really care in the first place. Have fun in your "carvet". You don't deserve to own a viper.

Thanks for reminding me. I looked and you are right. The fine print on the paperwork I signed for the GTS clearly states "the owner cannot ever think GM could develop a better car or my ownership rights would be revoked."

 

[FLYNLO]

I can't wait to see some side by side comparisons on these two cars. From what some of you guys post, the Viper might as well be a caravan. We'll see. I hope that most of you guys who post over here time and time and time and again really do buy a Vette.

lol..it's funny. I sure hope they do buy the vette. I'm sure there is a trailor park kingpin just waiting to get their hands on dat der new carvet z06!

 

[FLYNLO]

Here is a quote on the new Z06 from this months Sports Car International.

"...The end result is a distinctive-looking Corvette that goes faster than almost any other street-legal car available today. Notice I didn't say faster than any car in its price range, or faster than any mass-produced car."

Looks are subjective, but preformance isn't. I won't sell my GTS for one. But I definitely will buy it over the new SRT Coupe, even if the costs were equal, which they won't be.

Honestly, i dont think anyone here cares if you purchase a new zo6. As a matter of fact, im sure the other 30,000 who will own one by the beginning of next year will be the ONLY ones who really care in the first place. Have fun in your "carvet". You don't deserve to own a viper.

Thanks for reminding me. I looked and you are right. The fine print on the paperwork I signed for the GTS clearly states "the owner cannot ever think GM could develop a better car or my ownership rights would be revoked."

No, but if you would like to meddle with other GM owners, or express your intent to purchase the 500 hp motor in tupperware, you really should try to venture on down to the corvette forums. I'm sure the mullet militia is just sweating nervously waiting for you to put your deposit down on their mass produced carvet. Last time I checked, this was the SRT 10 forums, not anything goes.

 

[BobK898]

That's all great and dandy, LOL, but if the Z06 outperforms the Viper, I could give a crap if it looks better. 2 things that were tantamount to owning a Viper were its great looks and that it was King of the Road. To be in 2nd place behind a common Vette is a slap in the face, and somewhat of an embarrassment.

Anyone who walks around embarrassed and ashamed because he doesn’t have the most powerful car on the road really needs to re-think his priorities in life.

I don't think I need to re-examine my priorities but thanks for the suggestion, I'll give it the thought that it deserves. Vette-Viper is like Yankees-Red Sox to me. If you're in 2nd, well that just isn't good enough. And what they are showing so far just isn't good enough.

 

[pauljkopick]

I purchased my 01 RT/10,01 GTS,05VCA SRT10 for ME. I really dont care what anyone else in the entire world thinks of any of my rides. Every time I drive one of them I get excited.(includes our 05 SRT10 Quad Cab RAM). I just think we are some of the luckiest people in the world to own them & I love sharing them with other people,dosent matter if its someone who has never seen one or the 7 year old who cant take his eyes off of the snakes.Thanks DC for making VIPERS,cant imagine how it would be if they were never produced. I have never seen a VIPER I didnt like,I have nothing negative to say about any SNAKE. Count your blessings.I am !!!

 

[RavenFan_94]

Well said Paul.

 

[AG98RT10]

I'm confused at DCX showing and marketing the SRT 10. I attended the Detroit auto show today. Went and saw the new ZO6, sharp car, they had one on the platform they had a race version next to it on the platform and then had three other cars all in different colors for people to touch and sit in an drewl over. So then cruised over to the Dodge display, to see one viper the new coupe on the platform so no one could touch or sit in it. No convertibles of different colors Red, Yellow, Black, Silver or White. What gives Dodge doesn't want to sell the cars. There must be plenty cars at Conner Ave that they could show and let possible new viper owners sit in their dream car. Lets face it the dealers won't let any one sit in the cars at the dealerships, how does anyone that hasn't bought the car get to feel what we feel when we sit inside. Dodge needs to get closer to the people with their cars so people will buy their cars.

Werd! I just don't see how anyone can escape the conclusion that DC was caught completely flat-footed by the new Z06. This thing will just eat our lunch. If you believe otherwise, you are whistling past the graveyard.

We need to send a clear message NOW that the new coupe needs 600 hp and some other enhancements to stay competitive. Otherwise I really believe it will be bye-bye Viper in a couple of years or so...

 

[SnakeEye]

... I just don't see how anyone can escape the conclusion that DC was caught completely flat-footed by the new Z06. This thing will just eat our lunch. If you believe otherwise, you are whistling past the graveyard. -AG98RT10

And where is your test data that supports such a claim...





























...you don't have any because the C6 Z06 isn't even in production yet.

 

[Craig 201 MPH]

 

[Fiorano]

No, but if you would like to meddle with other GM owners, or express your intent to purchase the 500 hp motor in tupperware, you really should try to venture on down to the corvette forums. I'm sure the mullet militia is just sweating nervously waiting for you to put your deposit down on their mass produced carvet. Last time I checked, this was the SRT 10 forums, not anything goes.

Last time I checked, the starter of this thread specifically mentioned the corvette or however you choose to spell it. So, how do my comments get categorized as 'anything goes'? I love my GTS and think it is one of the best styled cars ever to be produced. It has a timeless design that the SRT10 coupe does not. If I think GM produces a better car, then I will say it.

 

[FLYNLO]

No, but if you would like to meddle with other GM owners, or express your intent to purchase the 500 hp motor in tupperware, you really should try to venture on down to the corvette forums. I'm sure the mullet militia is just sweating nervously waiting for you to put your deposit down on their mass produced carvet. Last time I checked, this was the SRT 10 forums, not anything goes.

Last time I checked, the starter of this thread specifically mentioned the corvette or however you choose to spell it. So, how do my comments get categorized as 'anything goes'? I love my GTS and think it is one of the best styled cars ever to be produced. It has a timeless design that the SRT10 coupe does not. If I think GM produces a better car, then I will say it.

REALLY TELL ME. How did they produce a better car? Have you driven one yet? Is your daddy the main engineer of the new zo6? Or perhaps you bought a C6 and think it's God's gift to mankind? Seriously, you can troll and talk all you want about how GM produces this and that, and how it is superior to chryslers products, but until you own one, i think i speak for everyone else on this board when i say, " THE CAR IS NOT OUT YET, STOP MAKING CONCLUSIONS." have a nice day.
ps. "It has a timeless design that the SRT10 coupe does not"
really? who made you the authority on what vehicle has a timeless design or not? All of this is pure opinion. We all know what an opinion is.."opinions are like As..... well, everyone has one."

 

[joe117]

It still boils down to this,
If the reports are correct, GM is coming out with a very well engineered sports car that will at least be a match for any stock Viper.

Now, will DC get into a horsepower race with GM? Will DC do anything to maintain real "king of the road" status?

No, I don't think so.
I see the regular Corvette as a real production car. It is produced in numbers that lead me to believe that GM actually wants to sell them, lots of them.

The ZO6 will not find as many buyers but I think GM will probably be interested in selling them.

The Viper, on the other hand, is not really what I would call an honest attempt by DC to produce a product for sale to the public. I don't think they really care if they sell many Vipers at all. They just want to have one in the showrooms and a quick flash of a Viper in a TV spot aimed at selling one of their other products.

I believe that the money GM spends on engineering and design for their Corvettes far outweighs what DC spends on Vipers.

So what am I getting at,
I don't think DC is really interested in producing a better performance sports car than GM.
DC will coast along on the Viper reputation. They are not even trying.