Help! No 5th 6th or Reverse???

[chnco]

Well, the unthinkable has happened to me.

I was cruising along today, just enjoying the car and not romping on it and suddenly the revs jump up while in 5th gear. There were no clunking noises or any grinding at all, it just jumped. So I put it into neutral and try 5th again, and there is nothing there. So I tried 6th gear, same thing.

I went into 4th gear, and 1-4th are all fine, no problems at all, so I get into a safe parking lot and try to figure out what's going on. Well, it looks like reverse was out too, which was really weird. When I put it into 5/6/R and let the clutch out, I can hear a slight metallic noise, but there are no thumps or anything.

Any ideas on what this is?? It drives fine in the first 4 gears, so I was thinking I can take it to a shop in the morning.

Thanks everyone!

 

[dave6666]

Drain the oil and look for shiny bits. Remember if it is indeed broken, all the liitle bits from the broken gears can get into the working gears and then you have ALL broken gears.

 

[Viper Specialty]

Older T-56 transmissions have a 2-piece output shaft, 1-4 and 5/6/R are on separate shafts. When the "teeth" which connect the two shafts together break off, you get the exact problem you are describing. Later T-56's from 2003 on had this solved with a one-piece countershaft instead.

You will need to either rebuild or replace the transmission unfortunately.

 

[chnco]

Dan,

Thank you for the reply, as I think you would be the most knowledgable about this car. Is this a fairly straight-forward rebuild that someone locally could do? Do you happen to know which parts would need replacing? And I'm assuming driving it to a repair shop would be a no no?

Bummer

 

[Viper Specialty]

Dan,

Thank you for the reply, as I think you would be the most knowledgable about this car. Is this a fairly straight-forward rebuild that someone locally could do? Do you happen to know which parts would need replacing? And I'm assuming driving it to a repair shop would be a no no?

Bummer

Yes, it is fairly straight forward. There is no way to check the extent of the damage until its apart. While you COULD drive it to the shop, it is possible to cause more damage to the trans in some cases. Likely? no... but possible. However, the extra trans damage may very well be less than the cost of towing and possible damage from towing, so its your call on that one.

 

[chnco]

Yes, it is fairly straight forward. There is no way to check the extent of the damage until its apart. While you COULD drive it to the shop, it is possible to cause more damage to the trans in some cases. Likely? no... but possible. However, the extra trans damage may very well be less than the cost of towing and possible damage from towing, so its your call on that one.

Thanks, will this require a new output shaft, or is the "teeth" an actual seperate part from the two shafts? I'm guessing the T56 is a popular enough tranny that any local transmission shop will be able to repair.

I've found lots of sources from LS1 Tech on rebuild kits which are very inexpensive, just trying to get a feel of what I will need to be getting.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

Thanks, will this require a new output shaft, or is the "teeth" an actual seperate part from the two shafts? I'm guessing the T56 is a popular enough tranny that any local transmission shop will be able to repair.

I've found lots of sources from LS1 Tech on rebuild kits which are very inexpensive, just trying to get a feel of what I will need to be getting.

Look here for the T56 manual.

http://www.ttcautomotive.com/English/media/pdfs_autogen/T-56_Service_Manual.pdf

Figure 3-8 shows part number 128, the countershaft extension. The teeth are at the lower end.

There are two large magnets in the bottom of the case which hold broken parts from jumping back into the gears. Not saying it's absolutely safe, but helps you decide about a drive to the shop.

 

[cyaford]

I'm selling my spare t-56 that needs a 5-6 synchro. Gears 1-5 and R are flawless. It's in the classifieds. I'll actually be driving from Nashville to Dalton in the next week or so. At least you're guaranteed to have 2 more usable gears compared to what you have now. You could then send your T56 off to Donato and have him do one of his conversions to make it stronger.

Now that I'm done with my selfish plug, 1TONY1 can also point you in the right direction, as far as a good local transmission shop.

 

[dave6666]

^^^ Someone ban this selfish pig

 

[uvbnbit]

Are you in the Chatt. area? I had mine rebuilt/upgraded forks last month. Very pleased.

 

[chnco]

Thank you everyone for the support!

Tom,
I'm assuming this would have to be ordered as the entire output shaft, I'm looking for the part here: T56 6 Speed Transmission Parts & Rebuild Kits and can't seem to find it.

Cyaford,
I might have to take you up on that, although from my understanding, Gen 1 and Gen 2 are not compatible? I'm not 100% sure on this. Thanks!

Uvbnbit,
I'm about an hour or so out from Chattanooga. Did you have it done locally, and do you happen to know pricing on something like that? Shoot me a PM if you prefer, thank you so much!

 

[V10SpeedLuvr]

Cyaford,
I might have to take you up on that, although from my understanding, Gen 1 and Gen 2 are not compatible? I'm not 100% sure on this. Thanks!

Gen 1, 2, 3 transmissions are all compatible. I went from a Gen 1 trans to a Gen 3 from Jon B. and it was a direct bolt-in. Very easy swap. Took the tech maybe 45 mins to pull mine and install the new one and that included a 10 min snack break. Different type of trans oil, but no changes install wise. You could go to a Gen 4 T-6060 trans, but thats when you get into heavy modifying.

 

[chnco]

Thanks Chad! Who did your swap, that sounds incredibly fast!! lol

I really don't have a need to have a modded tranny as I don't plan on going forced induction or anything. My only plan would be to have a more aggressive cam put in, otherwise stock.

 

[cyaford]

^^^ Someone ban this selfish pig

I'm just trying to not end up like Mike. I'm sure it starts out with just a few Viper parts laying around. Then before you know it, you've amassed a whole warehouse full of parts.

Speaking of parts, you still have that door fastener? Once I pick the Viper up in the next week or so, I'll be ready to tear into the door and fix the door panel issue.

Chnco: I actually lied in my previous reply. ALL gears are fine, it's just the 5/6 synchro. I can double clutch the 5-6 shift and engage 6th just fine when I want a fuel economy gear.

 

[chnco]

Thanks cyaford, that actually sounds really really tempting, when will you be in the Dalton area? It seems like this would be a very easy rebuild too, I'm trying to find a local mechanic that can do this. So 6th easily engages from neutral? I'm located in Kennesaw, which is fairly close.

Just curious, are Gen 2 trannys stronger by any way?

 

[V10SpeedLuvr]

Thanks Chad! Who did your swap, that sounds incredibly fast!! lol

One of the VCA guys who is a tech at Range Rover in Buckhead. I'm sure he'd do yours too. Be sure to bring the right trans oil with you. It took me double as long to get to and back from the Dodge dealer than it did him to do the swap (lovely Atlanta traffic )! All we did with mine was the trans swap. If you're gonna do the clutch and/or slave cylinder, it'll take a little longer obviously

 

[chnco]

One of the VCA guys who is a tech at Range Rover in Buckhead. I'm sure he'd do yours too. Be sure to bring the right trans oil with you. It took me double as long to get to and back from the Dodge dealer than it did him to do the swap (lovely Atlanta traffic )! All we did with mine was the trans swap. If you're gonna do the clutch and/or slave cylinder, it'll take a little longer obviously

That's incredible!! lol.

Do you have a screen name or contact info? I've taken the tranny out on my Supra, and it was a major PITA. My master/slave are brand new units already, so definitely no need for that. cyaford's tranny seems really tempting as a temporary fix, although I would have to have another one break

 

[cyaford]

Thanks cyaford, that actually sounds really really tempting, when will you be in the Dalton area? It seems like this would be a very easy rebuild too, I'm trying to find a local mechanic that can do this. So 6th easily engages from neutral? I'm located in Kennesaw, which is fairly close.

Kennesaw?! Too funny. I just spoke with Ryan at Injected Engineering. I wanted to try and have them tune my car after I picked it up in Dalton. I'm supposed to call them back after I know what day I'll be in the area. I'm hoping they have a cancellation, because they are booked out for several weeks.

 

[chnco]

lol, I believe I still know some people at Injected. I come from the import world, and they may recall a yellow Supra with V8HAHA on the tag

 

[cyaford]

When you pull your transmission, it would be a perfect time to replace the motor mounts and tranny mount with the Woodhouse units.

 

[chnco]

I hear they cause a lot of vibration? I just want my car back on the road

 

[cyaford]

I heard that as well. I had both my motor and trans mounts replaced. There was vibration at first, but it seems to have gone away after settling in for several hundred miles. Then again, maybe I'm just used to it.

 

[chnco]

I'm still debating on just sticking your tranny in there cyaford. What kind of fluid were you running?

I'm scared locals may not have enough experience with a T56. I've got several quotes today and it seems pretty inexpensive.

 

[V10SpeedLuvr]

That's incredible!! lol.

Do you have a screen name or contact info?

I've sent him a text. I'll give you his contact info as soon as he gives me the ok. He's not on this site much, so no screenname

 

[uvbnbit]

I hear they cause a lot of vibration? I just want my car back on the road

Poly motor mounts and tranny mounts here. Smooooth!!! no vibration in shifter and motor is solid under accel.
PM sent too.

 

[chnco]

Other than motor/tranny mounts, any other recommendations on parts to replace while I'm in there. Clutch is brand new with ~3k miles, and slave/master changed at same time, so I think I'm good in that department.

uvbnbit,
Thanks, I PM'ed you back!

 

[cyaford]

What kind of fluid were you running?

Castrol Syntorque.

 

[uvbnbit]

Year matters on fluid. Do a search on transmission fluids. Synthetic was used for the neutral gear rattle, but can also be harmful to filter/rings from what I remember....depending on year. 98-99, maybe??. I went back to Dexron.

 

[1TONY1]

I have a gen3 transmission, it was brand new and I put less than 2000 miles on it (probably a lot less, and no racing). UVBNBIT used it and put probably 1200 miles on it while his was being rebuilt. I'll install it and take yours in on trade for $2,200

I stopped using it when I got a gen4 transmission and I have since acquired another back up spare.

 

[plumcrazy]

id let tony do it, especially for that price.