I could not control myself: Raced a Lamborghini Murcielago!!!

[red98RT10]

Re: I could not control myself: Raced a Lamborghini Murcielago!!!

Wow! Quite a collection you've got there Viper585! I hope to have one like that someday too (if my wife doesn't divorce me first)!

 

[V 10 MAFIA]

Re: I could not control myself: Raced a Lamborghini Murcielago!!!

I can't see how the lambo can pull harder from 140 to 200 with almost 100 WHP less. The Viper's aerodynamics aren't that bad. The the Murci weighs at 3630 Lbs., not exactly light.

All depends on the gearing in the Viper. I ran serious top end runs with my cars. My 03 SRT ran 639RWHP. My Murci was modded slightly, and came in at 503. My Viper had the 3.55 gears as well. Under full burn, both cars about 2miles....I drove the Murci. Brother in the Viper. With AWD and a proper launch, my Murci could hit 3.35 to 60. I pulled the Viper about 2 cars to 60. Then it was C-YA for the SRT. My SRT could pull high tens, Murci with slight mods 11.5. I would begin to close on the viper at the mile mark, and reel him in before the Murci hit 195. The speed at the mile mark in the Murci was 174. The aerodynamics of the Murci are extremely strong, and the gearing is very tall. My car would actually hit close to 210. My Viper would run close to 200 before I changed the gears. I don't think the aerodynamics of the Gen 1 are as good as the Gen 3 cars...but just a visual guess there. The players:

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Thanks for your response, I really had no idea what the limitations were.

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

I can't see how the lambo can pull harder from 140 to 200 with almost 100 WHP less. The Viper's aerodynamics aren't that bad.

Aerodynamics advantages increase exponentially with speed.

 

[JUCD VPR]

Built 2 Go~ Way to go, very nice kill !!
\
viper585 ~ WOW you have an awesome collection, i'm jealous

 

[Makara]

I can't see how the lambo can pull harder from 140 to 200 with almost 100 WHP less. The Viper's aerodynamics aren't that bad.

Aerodynamics advantages increase exponentially with speed.

...and the RT/10s have a Cd of a jeep wrangler. I'm not kidding.

 

[Whoaa GTS]

Chuck,

Thanks for your reply.

You don't have to worry about me trying to FLY from 140 to 200mph. The early Viper Snakes were never known for their Top Speed due to major aerodynamics concerns. I believe the top safe speed back 12 years ago was only 170-175mph, before the Snake started lifting and becoming unstable.

Just out of curiosity is 170 the safe speed or the max speed? lol. How much of a difference does it make in the gen 1's or any rt's for that matter with a top and windows in? Whats the fastest recorded top speed for stock vipers gen1,2 rts, GTS's? I have heard that the gen 2 hood releases pressure under the hood making it more stable at high speed, any truth?

 

[hemibeep]

I remeber some years ago a T.V. road test of many "exotics". It was a closed interstate and they went about 1 mile each way and averaged the speed. I remeber the Gen II B/W doing 196, until a rad. hose let loose and the car puked coolant.

The one part I do remeber is most of the cars had tape all over the fronts, and the GTS needed none. I really wish I could remeber when & where that show was....

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

I've done many, many high speed runs in my 98 RT/10 years ago. Several times in a pack of GTSs. As I recall I don't think we were ever able to clear 180mph.

FYI The soft top does stay on at 175 mph, but it sounds like you're in a hurricane.

 

[VIPER GTSR 91]

Are you sure it was not a Murci kit car you out ran ??

 

[Built 2 Go]

Whoaa GTS,

In Reply to your question, "is 170 the safe speed or the max speed?

According to the book, Viper, Pure Performance by Dodge. They state " the early Gen I Vipers would reach 163 mph in fifth gear at 4900 rpm using 3:07 gears."

According to Car and Driver, July 1995. They indicate the Viper has a top speed of 168 mph, using 3:07 gears and no windows or top. They also indicate the Top Speed of a
95 Ferrari F355 was 179 mph. They also reflected that the Viper was 2/10's of a second faster then the Ferrari 355 in a 1/4 mile.

According to Motor Trend, June 2003. They indicated a Viper SRT-10 has a top speed of 182 mph. They also indicated that the top speed of a 2003 Lamborghini Murcielago was 193 mph. Their 1/4 mile results Reflected 11.77 @ 124 for the Viper and 11.74 @ 122 for the Lamborghini. Cost difference...$83,500 Viper vs $284,850 Lamborghini Murcielago.

According to Dan Cragin, (5 Star Viper Tuner) at D.C. Performance, my 93 R/T with the Paxton Supercharger (551rwhp & 566 Torque)is capable of much higher speeds with the Supercharger. However, he does not recommend higher speeds above 175 for my 93 R/T, unless some body type modifications are done to firmly hold the Viper down verses lifting.

For what it is worth...I will never be reaching for the 175 speed. The reason I purchased the Viper was for it's Awesome looks, very limited production and it's Reputation...American Olympic Gold Medal Sprinter. Equal to or better then the majority of... the most expensive and Exotic High Performance cars in the World !!!

Hopefully Dodge will rally around all us Viper owners and continue in the future to honor us and themselves with their uncompromised direction...Viper..American Olympic Gold Medal Sprinter. Over 13 years the Viper has held an awesome title of one of the most Feared cars on the road.

Gen I owners...if you can afford it, don't think twice. Go to a Supercharged Snake. The 93 has the same power and more then the non Supercharged Gen III'S & most 2006 Exotic's. Your will never be concerned about rolling up next to the new Z06 or Ford GT.

Both Roe and Paxton are well designed a Great units. It's really like night and day driving a GenI that is stock verses a Supercharged unit. The pull from the Supercharger is Worth every penny you pay for the unit. It's a "G" feeling you cannot explain. Bottomline...Find a Viper Tuner that is highly experienced on installation. Their expertise on installation and their experience on dialing in the correct gas, spark, etc for maximum power and realiabilty is so so important.

Built 2 Go

 

[glenn hofstetter]

I know every mile of PCH and its not safe to go 90mph let alone 140! That speed at night means you were out-driving your lights and in the day there is NO part of PCH that is empty enough to run anywhere near that speed any day of the week. What did you prove? You beat a heavier car with less power and endangered the lives of several, probably, many people. Had the CHP spotted you they would have taken your car and you would have never seen it again. Then you're dumb enough to brag about it on a public board! If you want to go fast try the Silver State or Bakersfield but grow up on the road before you kill your a$$. Actually I think that my first feeling about your post was correct, ITS ALL B.S.
See you at one of our club meetings

 

[Built 2 Go]

Glenn,

It appears that you are very-very upset over my "Stupidity". Indeed, you have the right & should be blazing mad & upset. Yes, I was an IDIOT and could not control my emotions when challenged. I am the first to admit that I was entirely wrong!!!...especially at my age of 60. Not very smart!!!

The encounter DID NOT occur at night. There was no indication on my post of Night Driving. It was last Sunday Morning around 8am. I was going to meet my Daughter at a restrauant (Las Brisas in Laguna) for breakfast.

It appears you live in La Palma, a good distance from Newport. I have lived in the Newport Beach area for 40 years and also know the complete area and all of PCH. I drive it daily.

The area where the Lamborghini challenged me (I did not challenge him....not that it matters), was outside of Corona Del Mar where the road turns into 3 lanes in each direction and the speed limit is 55 mph. The exact area was near Newport Coast Drive (very long staight stretchs). There was no traffic or other cars in front of me or the Lamborghini. Most people are still sleeping at 8am on Sunday in Newport.

The entire challenge took about 7 to 10 seconds (I am guessing, before I backed off). The only person I endangered was myself.

Again...I'm very aware of my stupidy and Fully understand...Speed Kills. I don't challenge other cars.

Gleen, for what it's worth. My emotions got the best of me when he came out of no where, flew by me with his deafening Exhaust, applied his brakes and then he & his girlfriend smiled as I came alongside of his Yellow machine. The next second he applied full throttle and I reacted.
It happened so so quickly.

No excuses, I was WRONG and made a WRONG decision.

 

[00prowler]

I know every mile of PCH and its not safe to go 90mph let alone 140! That speed at night means you were out-driving your lights and in the day there is NO part of PCH that is empty enough to run anywhere near that speed any day of the week. What did you prove? You beat a heavier car with less power and endangered the lives of several, probably, many people. Had the CHP spotted you they would have taken your car and you would have never seen it again. Then you're dumb enough to brag about it on a public board! If you want to go fast try the Silver State or Bakersfield but grow up on the road before you kill your a$$. Actually I think that my first feeling about your post was correct, ITS ALL B.S.
See you at one of our club meetings

Lighten up Glen, You sound like his FATHER!! Al...

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

No excuses, I was WRONG and made a WRONG decision.

Sure, but you didn't endanger anyone but yourself so there is no reason to be so ******* you. It's the dips that go blasting through traffic that are ultra-stupid.

 

[BigCarrot]

I know every mile of PCH and its not safe to go 90mph let alone 140! That speed at night means you were out-driving your lights and in the day there is NO part of PCH that is empty enough to run anywhere near that speed any day of the week. What did you prove? You beat a heavier car with less power and endangered the lives of several, probably, many people. Had the CHP spotted you they would have taken your car and you would have never seen it again. Then you're dumb enough to brag about it on a public board! If you want to go fast try the Silver State or Bakersfield but grow up on the road before you kill your a$$. Actually I think that my first feeling about your post was correct, ITS ALL B.S.
See you at one of our club meetings

How does it feel to drive around with a corn cob up your ass?

 

[GARY J]

I think Henn essey went something like 217 with about 560rwhp, so I don't think the Murci would have the snake at any speed.

 

[VIPR GTS]

Built 2 go, nice to see another oldie doing stupid things in their car, I don't feel alone now. Good Job. I would jump all over the chance to run a Merci, or any F car or or or or, (anything exotic).

 

[00prowler]

Built 2 go, nice to see another oldie doing stupid things in their car, I don't feel alone now. Good Job. I would jump all over the chance to run a Merci, or any F car or or or or, (anything exotic).

I agree, I'm sick of having a c5 Vette as my best kill...Al...

 

[VENOMAHOLIC]

FYI The soft top does stay on at 175 mph, but it sounds like you're in a hurricane.

[/QUOTE]
I wondered about that soft top issue. Thanks for the info.

 

[vipeuup]

I know every mile of PCH and its not safe to go 90mph let alone 140! That speed at night means you were out-driving your lights and in the day there is NO part of PCH that is empty enough to run anywhere near that speed any day of the week. What did you prove? You beat a heavier car with less power and endangered the lives of several, probably, many people. Had the CHP spotted you they would have taken your car and you would have never seen it again. Then you're dumb enough to brag about it on a public board! If you want to go fast try the Silver State or Bakersfield but grow up on the road before you kill your a$$. Actually I think that my first feeling about your post was correct, ITS ALL B.S.
See you at one of our club meetings

How does it feel to drive around with a corn cob up your ass?

HA

 

[V 10 MAFIA]

I think Henn essey went something like 217 with about 560rwhp, so I don't think the Murci would have the snake at any speed.

I'm glad Gary posted this and hope that the run was accurate. I don't think a Viper that can pull 217 would also be a dog from 150 to 200 because of aerodynamics. And there is no way in hell the aero drag is a bad as a Jeep Wrangler.

 

[BACKNBLACK]

Yo V10, tell these guys how I make any SUV fast

 

[V 10 MAFIA]

Yes there is one exception when Black N Black is out on the road with the SUV. He Squeezes even last horspower out the engine. You can hear the motor crying for help as he's making 140mph passes.

 

[viper585]

I think Henn essey went something like 217 with about 560rwhp, so I don't think the Murci would have the snake at any speed.

I'm glad Gary posted this and hope that the run was accurate. I don't think a Viper that can pull 217 would also be a dog from 150 to 200 because of aerodynamics. And there is no way in hell the aero drag is a bad as a Jeep Wrangler.

Not possible. Show me where a 560RWHP Viper ran 217. And Keep in mind I have had an H car at 712RWHP that topped out at 207. The Gen 1 cars are a brick at speed. The drag co. # is horrible. You can't run into the 210's with 560 RWHP in a Gen 1 or 2. Again, as I said...my 03SRT with 639 RWHP and stock gears topped out at 200. And the Gen 3's have a better drag co. # than the 1 and 2's.

 

[Makara]

I think Henn essey went something like 217 with about 560rwhp, so I don't think the Murci would have the snake at any speed.

I'm glad Gary posted this and hope that the run was accurate. I don't think a Viper that can pull 217 would also be a dog from 150 to 200 because of aerodynamics. And there is no way in hell the aero drag is a bad as a Jeep Wrangler.

I believe that the Cd of a RT/10 with the top off was .55 (.50 with the top on) which is what the Cd of a wrangler is with a hard top. I have heard that the GTS is anywhere between .33 and .39.

 

[SnakeBitten]

You can't run into the 210's with 560 RWHP in a Gen 1 or 2. Again, as I said...my 03SRT with 639 RWHP and stock gears topped out at 200. And the Gen 3's have a better drag co. # than the 1 and 2's.

You probably mean gen 1&2 RT/10's not the GTS...The GTS best recorded top speed was 192mph bone stock according to MT...And thats with only around 420rwhp stock...So I would think that a gen 2[GTS] with 551rwhp would easily be in the 200mph range..And the GTS cd is .35. I doubt the SRT is that low......I think the GTS would be aerodynamic enough to outrun a Murci to any speed if GTS had 551rwhp and stock gearing..

 

[allanlambo]

Very nice run. My friend has an 04 E-Gear Merci and I have ran him too. Not as fast as I thought. I am stock and I keep up without a problem.

Haha you are racing Rehan, and he is a nice guy, but you are definitely not racing a murci that is being driven to its full potential. When i was in the car with him, he went to semi race someone in his car, and he downshifts to 4th from 6th, when he should of been in 2nd. And he never goes to redline. He babies that thing like crazy.

 

[allanlambo]

orlandov10,

F355 is a stock Viper, "keep up" meant .."he had me by 1 car length".

The 93 Paxton Supercharged Viper had the 2005/2006 Lamborghini by 5 to 6 car lengths from 45mph to 140mph.

Built 2 Go

Here I am to save the day!!! LOL First off, let me say, that I do believe a 550rwhp Viper will take a Murcielago. But I do think with a driver who knows what he is doing, it would have been alot closer. From your post you said you ran from 45mph, and I would bet my life the murci driver started in 2nd, where the Murci is dead in the water, and should be in 1st. I know several Murci drivers, and as stated above, most cannot drive. Also, if the Murci had exhaust, it would lose 100lbs. Anyways, in my opinion, given equal drivers, i dont think from say a 30 mph roll to 150mph, a Viper would get anymore than 2 cars out on the murci, and soon after the Murci would real him in and take over.

Guy in a 6.0 Diablo, with only exhaust who races constantly, just raced a Heads/cam Z06 with a 100 shot, and the Z06 got him by 2 cars. You probobly have seen his videos, as he raced a worked T/A named Havoc awhile ago and beat him (low 11sec car) and now raced him again with nitrous and beat him again. So I figure the Z06 will make slightly less power than the Viper in question here, but have several hundred lbs less weight, and better aerodynamics, not to mention a Murci with exhaust should be slightly faster than the 6.0.

Anyways, nice race! Im here in Scottsdale now, and almost raced a Viper Srt in my Esprit, We both laid into it at about 60mph, and he didnt pull me, but it was an uneven start. I tried to get him to go from a 30mph roll, but he turned off. I also raced my friends Gallardo, and my Esprit barely nips him. his bumper is at my door.

Viper585, lets see your Murci dyno sheet please.

 

[Snakester]

I think Henn essey went something like 217 with about 560rwhp, so I don't think the Murci would have the snake at any speed.

I'm glad Gary posted this and hope that the run was accurate. I don't think a Viper that can pull 217 would also be a dog from 150 to 200 because of aerodynamics. And there is no way in hell the aero drag is a bad as a Jeep Wrangler.

I believe that the Cd of a RT/10 with the top off was .55 (.50 with the top on) which is what the Cd of a wrangler is with a hard top. I have heard that the GTS is anywhere between .33 and .39.

Frontal Area 19.3 sq. ft. (1.79 sq. m.) - RT/10
20.5 sq. ft. (1.90 sq. m.) - GTS
Drag Coefficient 0.495 (top off)
0.46 (soft top)
0.45 (hard top) - RT/10
0.35 - GTS

SRT-10 Viper Drag coefficient 0.40
Frontal Area 1.79 m2
Cx 0.72

The Wrangler has a MUCH bigger frontal area:
28.2 sq ft (2.62 sq m) hard top; 28.3 sq ft
(2.63 sq m) soft top
Drag Coefficient:
0.55 hard top; 0.58 soft top

The stock GTS has gone 192MPH with around 420RWHP, and the SRT-10 Viper has managed 189MPH with around 435RWHP (impressive for a convertible).

But offhand I'm not really concerned about any top speed advantage that a car like the Murcielago might have.
As foolish as a high speed run on a public highway would be running up to 150MPH, it would clearly be insane to try and run upwards of 200MPH on any public road (at least one that wasn't closed off for a high speed racing event in the desert).

Top speed is one of the most overrated performance attributes for cars actually driven on normal roads.