Its good to be back

[MikeDGTS]

Hello All. I havent been on the board much since I sold my GTS about a year ago. I am back b/c my dad is picking up the new SRT-10 in the near future. I love the M3 I picked up after I sold the Viper, but it will be good to borrow Dad's car to drive a car with some real horsepower. M3 owners flame me when I complain that I need more HP, but after driving the Viper everything else does not seem as fast. I would appreciate if I can get some info/reviews on the SRT-10, so I will ask a few questions.

1) On paper the SRT-10 with more power and lighter weight, should walk away from the Gen II GTS, however most of the reviews that Ive seen show similar performance #s. Has anyone gone head to head stock SRT vs. stock GTS?

2) I had a couple [******] mods on my GTS, only to realize later that those were way overpriced. Does this still seem to be the general concensus on his products? Also, I am in FL and I remember Doug Levin (sp?) supercharged many Gen IIs with great reviews. Does he have the same success with the SRTs?

3) Are there many known problems as with the Gen I/IIs (ex: Water leaking, headlight condensation, etc)?

Thanks in advance for any info you can provide!

 

[SJT97GTS]

I can't give you any GEN III advise, because I don't own one. I'm still on the part where you said you sold your GTS and replaced it with an M3! That's just crazy .

 

[Viperzilla]

Don't go through [******], IMO. Still overpriced, hasn't fixed all the past problems. I don't think anyone has SC'd an SRT yet.

 

[MikeDGTS]

I can't give you any GEN III advise, because I don't own one. I'm still on the part where you said you sold your GTS and replaced it with an M3! That's just crazy .

Haha. I cant say that I really wanted to sell the GTS, but I gave my 330i to my fiance, so I needed something a little more practical for an everyday driver. The M3 is a great all around car for the money, but does not have the blistering straight line speed of the Viper. But with the weak A/C in the GTS, driving that thing to work sitting in traffic every day with that FL heat was not much fun. When I can afford to buy an extra car, a late model GTS will be high on my list.

 

[John Myrick]

I have a GTS and an SRT-10. Contrary to others results, I was able to get a noticeably quicker quarter mile time and higher mile per hour than I could with my GTS. I drove my totally stock SRT-10 to an 11.86 / 123 MPH quarter mile on my first trip to the drag strip with it. Not a huge improvement over my GTS but it was almost 0.2 seconds quicker and 4 mph faster.

I will also add that I have modified the SRT-10 and it did not seem to gain as much from intake and exhaust modifications as the Gen II's did. Next in line was heads and cam (Venom 600R, featured in the October Car & Driver). This package made good power at the higher rpms and C&D drove the car to the tune of 3.4 seconds 0-60 and 11.4 / 127 MPH quarter mile on the stock tires. A noticeable improvement to what they got out of a stock SRT-10

0.5 second quicker to 60 mph
1 second quicker to 100 MPH, and
over 6 seconds quicker to 150 MPH

The current state of tune (Venom 650R, 522 inch stroker) performed very well with 2.99 0-60 MPH and 10.76 / 132 MPH in the quarter mile on the stock tires (to be published in the December issue of Motor Trend magazine). I'm not sure if it would have passed emmisions testing, but it still had catalytic convertors installed for these tests.

I would say that the comment about Viper modifications being overpriced applies to all of the Viper tuners I have checked prices with and is commonly referred to as the Viper tax.

If you decide to modify the SRT-10, take a look at everyone's offerings and get some price quotes.

[******]'s pricing should be right in line with the others, and may even be lower. He has recently completed work on my SRT-10 Venom 650R, so I have first hand experience. As a judge of my satisfaction, I am considering the Venom Twin Turbo package for my GTS. And although there has not been much publicity, he has taken huge steps toward fixing his past problems. I know of three of the big internet cases in which he has made significant progress: HP, No Mercy, and Taig.

Even if you don't support a particular tuner through purchases, their continued presence in the Viper tuner industry adds competition in the market place which should result in lower prices for us, the end users.

 

[MikeDGTS]

Thanks for the info, John. I guess you are right about all Viper mods being overpriced. I cant get away from it, since trying to get more HP out of the M3 is like trying to squeeze that last bit of toothpaste in the tube.

I saw the C&D article you mentioned, and I was quite impressed. Sounds like your car will be a beast. Personally, I am still biased towards the GTS even if it is a little "slower". That twin turbo pkg on a GTS would be my dream car. Good luck with both of them.

 

[Lee00blacksilverGTS]

You sold a black/silver GTS to get an M3?!! Sorry, I think your DAD made that decision. He had a GTS and then he traded or sold for an SRT. They were HIS cars. And your car is an M3? Consider yourself lucky. But NOBODY swaps a GTS for an M3. Not believable.

 

[Viperfreak2]

I think he explained the fiance / hot Florida / more practical daily driver issues pretty clearly. The M3's build quality is so far above the GTS it's unreal. I wouldn't mind having a carbon black M3 convertible...and a GTS!

 

[MikeDGTS]

You sold a black/silver GTS to get an M3?!! Sorry, I think your DAD made that decision. He had a GTS and then he traded or sold for an SRT. They were HIS cars. And your car is an M3? Consider yourself lucky. But NOBODY swaps a GTS for an M3. Not believable.

Im glad you're the expert, Boss. Do you drive your GTS to work everyday? Viperfreak is right, the build quality on my M3 far exceeds that of the GTS. It's tough driving to a business lunch with water dripping from the windshield. Dont get me wrong, the GTS is the most fun Ive ever had in a car (while driving), but it is far from the luxury appeal of BMW.

BTW, why is it so hard to believe I got rid of my Viper? A 2003 M3 goes for about the same price or more than a 2000 GTS. Plus, I never really got to use the 450+HP while bumper to bumper in FL. So enjoy your Black/Silver GTS. I will own another, except probably in Silver next time, but only in addition to my M3 which I can drive to work, dinner, or wherever everyday.

 

[normix]

I apologize if this question has been asked many times before.. I am new to the List, but not new on the desire to own a Viper.

Question: Can the Viper SRT-10 be used as your main every day car; commuting to work, 5 hour road trips for work, park in shopping center parking lots, etc. OR is the Viper meant as a 3rd car only??

THANK YOU!
Norm
current car: 2003 Infinity G35 Coupe (its a boring ***** car)
previous 2000 Corvette (I miss)
Previuos M3 BMW
Previuos 300ZX

 

[Lee00blacksilverGTS]

Actually I do drive it as long as I can keep it in veiw when it is parked. Which has nothing to do with the cars liabilities but with the general brainlessness of the great unwashed public and what they tend to do to the car out of jealousy. And NOTHING has ever gone wrong with the GTS. And I don't have any AC issues, and it gets HOT here. And as far as BMW build quality....it is to laugh. I recently sold a 2001 Carbon black M5 that I bought new, I put 20k on it, now let's see....
1. Constant and not fixable Vanos noise.
2. Constant and not fixable rear end whine.
3. The worst clutch made on the planet.
3. The worst Navigation system made on the planet.
4. No spare, but not run flats?
5. Unreliable tire pressure indicators.
6. Wheel paint that cannot be repaired or obtained or duplicated in the US as the paint was made in Italy and is not environmentally legal in the US. $700 PAINTED wheels? That cannot be fixed if scratched?
7. Several recalls due to the possibility of electrical fire.
8. Very severe oil consumption issues.
9. Paint that chips when you look at it.
10. And the most arrogant, insensitive dealers on the planet. a 1995 70k mile loaner with holes in the console where the power window switches used to be?
These are not just MY issues, I used to spend more time on www.bimmer.org and www.bmwm5.com than I did here, and the above problems are very common. And the problems with M3's are well documented as well. And let's not forget the price of labor and repair parts when you are comparing service. A Viper is a Dodge and repair parts and most parts are equal to other Dodges. And of insurance, my M5 cost 30% MORE to insure than the Viper. Due to the high cost of repair parts and labor if damaged. I owned both the GTS and the M5 at the same time, note which one is gone.

 

[MikeDGTS]

I know first hand that the GTS is not the best everyday car, however it makes an awesome 2nd car. I would assume the SRT is slightly better, but probably still a loud gas guzzler you would not want everyday for long commutes. Filling up the tank in my GTS every two days got old. But if you have a decent ride for everyday, the Viper will be great for everything else.

Lee, sorry to hear about your luck with the M5. I know ALL cars have documented problems, and sometimes its the luck of the draw. I know alot of the early E46 M3's were blowing engines, but (knock on wood) Im at 10,000 miles with no problems. I get good gas mileage (about 20 city, 28 hwy), good performance, all my service (including oil change) is paid by BMW for 4 yrs. This is my 2nd Bimmer, and it will not be my last. So far the sales and service experience has been great. IMO you cannot beat the all around package (looks, perf, driveablity) with anything less than a 911 Carrera. I had the Z06 as well, and it was kind of boring IMO. There are thousands of Vettes out there, and with the coilovers and stock 19" wheels I get way more compliments on the BMW.

 

[Tomer]

How does the M5 stack up to the Viper performance wise (0-60, 1/4 mile)?

I see the odd one in the parking lot at work, and they look bad!!

Tomer

 

[Longo]

As the owner of both an M5 and SRT-10, all I can say is they are completely different vehicles. With 100 less HP and a lot more weight, the M5 obviously doesn't have the neck-snapping acceleration of the SRT. I think the 0-60 is about 1 sec slower and, having never had either at the track, I couldn't say what the 1/4 difference would be, other than what's published. It also doesn't have the same trigger-quick handling as the SRT. And it doesn't get anything close to the SRT crowd reaction. The SRT is without a doubt, the quickest, most visceral and downright funnest car I have ever had the pleasure of owning. Let's face it, however, it is basically two seats strapped to an engine. As a daily driver, the M5 is an amazing automobile. Great power, acceleration, brakes and handling....all wrapped up in a package that is as smooth, quiet, comfortable, user-friendly as anything I can imagine. 4 doors (for the kiddies), big trunk, great stereo (that you can actually enjoy even at wide open throttle), seats you can sit in for hours, navigation system (no more trying to read a map while you're driving), perfect climate control in any weather, and luxurious fit and finish......and can still blow the doors off of most others on the road. Last, but certainly not least, not a single problem in 2 years and 28,000 miles. All in all....not a bad trade-off.

 

[Longo]

Didn't read Lee's back luck with an M5 until after my last post. Sorry to hear. All I know is my personal experience and, as I indicated, the car's been in the shop twice in 28,000 miles.....both for oil changes and factory service only. Mine is a 2002 so perhaps some changes were made.