JFurman..trade your ACR for a 2010ACR

[Twister]

First of all who said the SRT is DEAD .On top of that your saying Dodge spent millions of dollars (years of time ect )for this secret recertification to get more power and will not market the increase because it would be a slap in the face to past Gen 4 Viper owners (SO EVERYTIME a cars power is increased its NEVER MARKETED because it would be a slap in the face to previous generations of owners )***

We will just keep disagreeing....But you gotta be asking your self how they were so confidant that the ACR would beat the previous best...Areo tweaks and 5th gear change????

Suely even you have to admit that something dosent add up here..

 

[1BADGTS]

dude..The srt10 is gone with the wind bro..They said 2010 is the last year..With somthing new in 2012...That 2012 will be a totally differant car..With lots of influence from ferrari and possibly under a differant label than Viper...

Once they said engineering from ferrari I knew it was all over..I mean really...With the ACR selling much better than they ever expected for 100K a pop...Why stop makeing them????

The vipers gone after the 2010's roll out...Thats why Im bending over backwards to get a 2003 srt to add with my 91 nsx right now...Two of the first years of extinct beaste...it'll be my third viper....i wouldnt be buying it if they hadnt announced the death of the viper in 2010..

But if it's true and the viper dos die in 2010 and comes back in 2012 as a totally differant car with a 6.0 V10 ferrari influanced engine and 650 HP for a price of 125K and they call it something else......

THEN IM ANTICIPATEING THE VIPERS TO HOLD STEADY OR RISE IN VALUE..

MY bUDDY JUST SOLD HIW 2005 NSX FOR 68k...Ive had offers of 31K on my 1991 nsx...I honestly think a SRT10 is the better car in every single way..But nsx sell for MUCH more year vrs year simply because they dont make them any more...

Hopefully the viper will do the same.


Anyways..got off topic a bit..2010 Viper is gonna be F-A-S-T

Your forgetting one SMALL FACTOR ,it TAKES anywhere FROM 3-5 years TO DEVELOP A NEW generation OF Viper. Accordingly any plans to produce a Gen 5 Viper (due out next year) means the R&D had to be done YEARS AGO .Ferrari -whoever has to be using MOST of the plan DODGE developed for the fifth Gen of Viper if the car is meant to be.

 

[1BADGTS]

We will just keep disagreeing....But you gotta be asking your self how they were so confidant that the ACR would beat the previous best...Areo tweaks and 5th gear change????

Suely even you have to admit that something dosent add up here..

Its sapples and oranges=because the car is now faster around a road coarse DOES NOT MEAN its of all things 2 tenths of a second faster on a drag strip.

 

[Twister]

and if Im right..If the Viper is dead and srt makes some tweaks to add some under the table rwhp for the final car?????

I personally beleave you are right and the 2008 and 2009 might be able to squeeze out a 10.8x at 131 mph in time..Still not enough to dethrown the zr1...

Thats not my argument..My argument is what if they sneak in some more rwhp for this last Viper in 2010...Lets just say another 20 rwhp so that instead of the current dynos of 540-560 rwhp..All the 2010's dyno 560-580 rwhp..

That lil 20 rwhp will be enough for a 2010 to possibly dethrown the ZR1...


To add to this and how simple pcm changes are to do without recertifying the engine...

Remember all those 2006 coupes in the mags trapping 116-119 mph..Pretty low for an SRT10 right..Especially when the 2003-2005 verts were all in the 119-123 range in the mags..

Well many 2006 coupes only dynoed in the 410-420 rwhp range..Their was a pcm change on the 06's that really only seemed to effect the coupes..Do a search on it...These were the weakest of all the SRT's..it wasnt all of them..But a good percentage of the 06 coupes suffered from this..

The point is that their was never a recert of any kind saying hey your 06 coupe is 475 crank HP...

Likewise..None will be needed if a pcm tweak yields 20 additional rwhp on the 2010's..

 

[Twister]

ibadgts..Heres a list I made a few years ago to illistrate what a srt10 dynos SAE and how much it can vary...So 2010's coming out with another 20 plus rwhp over the 09's isnt as big a deal as you think...just check out these gen3 dyno's..



They are in the order that I found them on Viper alley and then VCA......


-Import Image...456/518

-FiskeGTS..........455/481 STD

-Tito..................468/493

-Kansas............452/503 SAE

-ViperSRT..........445/480

-Vmotorsports...430/455

-Cory.................459/484

-Larry................447/476

-Tim Sutherland.455/484 SAE

-Dan sutherland.441/472 SAE

-Anthony Boutt..441/457 SAE

-Mike and Julie...425???

-Joseph Dell customer...452/490 SAE

-Ooomph............449/489

-ViperX...............450/490

-Viperbilliam.......425/480

-Bandit118th.....451/492

-Valantine Viper.442/482

-BlackSRTCoupe.457/481 SAE

-Ulllose..............438??? SAE

-BobK................434/465

-GR8ASP...........445???

-1TONY1...........437/482

-Fadi.................437/475

-ViperNM..........430/475

-Y2K5SRT.........464/504

-VNMOUS.........434???

-SRT10DYNODAY.459
...........................447
...........................452
...........................464
...........................435
...........................436
...........................420
...........................436

-KaiSRT10...........439/470

-Viper Ruselli......433/468

-PMBNY..............437/504

-DSR207............423???

-SRT10LEN........420/510

-DawgZsnake...437/466 SAE

-Cajun Viper.....447/490

-John Myrick.....445/483

-Frank03SR......440/487

-SirFang...........418???


If it dosent say SAE or STD then the info was not available...

Seemed like the SRT10's are a mixed bag...Some are 420's-430's...Some are 450's-460's...

Thats a 40 rwhp differance...

 

[1BADGTS]

and if Im right..If the Viper is dead and srt makes some tweaks to add some under the table rwhp for the final car?????

I personally beleave you are right and the 2008 and 2009 might be able to squeeze out a 10.8x at 131 mph in time..Still not enough to dethrown the zr1...

Thats not my argument..My argument is what if they sneak in some more rwhp for this last Viper in 2010...Lets just say another 20 rwhp so that instead of the current dynos of 540-560 rwhp..All the 2010's dyno 560-580 rwhp..

That lil 20 rwhp will be enough for a 2010 to possibly dethrown the ZR1...


To add to this and how simple pcm changes are to do without recertifying the engine...

Remember all those 2006 coupes in the mags trapping 116-119 mph..Pretty low for an SRT10 right..Especially when the 2003-2005 verts were all in the 119-123 range in the mags..

Well many 2006 coupes only dynoed in the 410-420 rwhp range..Their was a pcm change on the 06's that really only seemed to effect the coupes..Do a search on it...These were the weakest of all the SRT's..it wasnt all of them..But a good percentage of the 06 coupes suffered from this..

The point is that their was never a recert of any kind saying hey your 06 coupe is 475 crank HP...

Likewise..None will be needed if a pcm tweak yields 20 additional rwhp on the 2010's..

THE problem with your argument is this to increase power you MUST RECERTIFY (AND NO MATTER HOW MANY TIMES I OR ANYONE ELSE TELLS YOU THIS YOU WILL NOT LISTEN )and that recertification would cost millions and would have to have taken place years ago.If that was done the car would now be marketed as such.Again go back to the facts NAME one time in history just one that a car came out with a horsepower bump and was not marketed as such.You can not just SNEAK engine changes by the smog police .

 

[1BADGTS]

ibadgts..Heres a list I made a few years ago to illistrate what a srt10 dynos SAE and how much it can vary...So 2010's coming out with another 20 plus rwhp over the 09's isnt as big a deal as you think...just check out these gen3 dyno's..



They are in the order that I found them on Viper alley and then VCA......


-Import Image...456/518

-FiskeGTS..........455/481 STD

-Tito..................468/493

-Kansas............452/503 SAE

-ViperSRT..........445/480

-Vmotorsports...430/455

-Cory.................459/484

-Larry................447/476

-Tim Sutherland.455/484 SAE

-Dan sutherland.441/472 SAE

-Anthony Boutt..441/457 SAE

-Mike and Julie...425???

-Joseph Dell customer...452/490 SAE

-Ooomph............449/489

-ViperX...............450/490

-Viperbilliam.......425/480

-Bandit118th.....451/492

-Valantine Viper.442/482

-BlackSRTCoupe.457/481 SAE

-Ulllose..............438??? SAE

-BobK................434/465

-GR8ASP...........445???

-1TONY1...........437/482

-Fadi.................437/475

-ViperNM..........430/475

-Y2K5SRT.........464/504

-VNMOUS.........434???

-SRT10DYNODAY.459
...........................447
...........................452
...........................464
...........................435
...........................436
...........................420
...........................436

-KaiSRT10...........439/470

-Viper Ruselli......433/468

-PMBNY..............437/504

-DSR207............423???

-SRT10LEN........420/510

-DawgZsnake...437/466 SAE

-Cajun Viper.....447/490

-John Myrick.....445/483

-Frank03SR......440/487

-SirFang...........418???


If it dosent say SAE or STD then the info was not available...

Seemed like the SRT10's are a mixed bag...Some are 420's-430's...Some are 450's-460's...

Thats a 40 rwhp differance...

CHASIS DYNOS ALWAYS VARY these certifications are done on ENGINE DYNOS .I really dont think you realize how much trouble and money it is for a car company to get a motor certifyed .Even IF you had the twenty to the tire you always seem to IGNORE JAMIE FURMANS STATEMENT (AND I DONT KNOW WHY)that the ZR-1 was no where near maxed out in running 10.7 at 133 .8.JAMIE HAS POSTED NUMERIOUS TIMES (AND YOU ABSOLUTELY KNOW THIS )THAT HE FEELS HE CAN GO MID 10.5 AT 135 in the right weather. What then.

 

[ViperGeorge]

The ZR-1 is lighter ,has a better rear end ratio ,its engine makes a little more power its chasis is better suited to drag race and the car posts better aero numbers.ET represents horsepower while trap speed at the end of the quarter mile represents or is an indication of TRUE HORSEPOWER . Jamie best times WERE NOT posted in his ACR but his Gen 4 roadster.Another importantant factor here is in Jamies expert opinion that the Gen4 was ABSOLUTELY MAXED out running 10.9 at near 130 was while the ZR-1 had not reached its potential at 10.7 at near 134.

Would the Viper need to be certified again if they change the rear end ratio? Is it possible with a rear gear change for the Viper to match or beat the ZR1? Thanks.

 

[C.Hermsen]

There's a quick and simple resolution to this dispute....how about we just wait until the 2010s roll out and someone buys one, and dynos it, opposed to speculating like crazy. Problem solved.

 

[MbnViper]

well said....I agree 1000000000000%%%%%%%%%

But....A lil more rwhp from srt would defiently let her die with an even bigger bang....Advertising more HP would be a slap in the face to 2008 and 2009 owners....But a lil more under the table rwhp would really seal the deal of the ultimate american sports car...At the club...At the track..or on the strip..
Right now the Viper has the wow factor at the club and the overall faster times at the track..While the Zr1 is winning at the strip...

man all this talk f the new viper possibly haveing more power is really turning me on..

Think Im on Track for the ********** tonight.....Sorry..couldnt resist..

i hear you.

just let us wait and see maybe the Viper legacy will continue and we will see a new model coming, even so i believe a street race between the two is so close and a driver race.

but for me on streets ZR1 who..say again ?

 

[1BADGTS]

Would the Viper need to be certified again if they change the rear end ratio? Is it possible with a rear gear change for the Viper to match or beat the ZR1? Thanks.

NO CAN DO thats why the 3.07 is in there now (the car could not pass certain tests -i believe it highway noise )with a 3.33 or a 3.54.