More test results (hint: close, but Viper wins again)

[Vipermann]

Motor Trend:

2008 Viper:
0-60 .................... 3.7
0-100 .................. 7.9
1/4 mi ................. 11.7 @124.4 mph

2008 Z06:
0-60 .................... 3.7
0-100 .................. 8.2
1/4 mi ................. 11.8 @121.6 mph

C&D:

2008 Viper:
0-60 .................... 3.5
0-100 .................. 7.6
1/4 mi ................. 11.6 @126 mph

2008 Z06:
0-60 .................... 3.7
0-100 .................. 7.7
1/4 mi ................. 11.7 @125 mph

Now here's something interesting that suggests C&D and MT may have used different shifting strategies with the Viper:

2008 Viper:
MT 0-140 .............15.1 (5th gear?)
C&D 0-150 ...........17.0 (6th gear?)

2008 Z06:
MT 0-140 .............16.1
C&D 0-150 ...........17.5


... and for perspective (in MT): $140,000+ Porsche GT3RS, 0-140, 18.5; $379,000 Lambo Murcielago, 0-140, 15.2.

 

[mike & juli]

Wow, thank you for taking the time to post the stats we are all looking for...the comparisons, 0-60, 1/4mile...hmmm...5th & 6th gears?? Guess that's possible getting up to 140-150mph? Thanx again! ~juli

 

[96-RT10 Supercharged]

Nice, thanks.

I love it when American cars fight it out. Without the competition European cars win, but when the US fights with itself, it's amazing what we can do ...haha

 

[Viper X]

The 2008 will do 160 mph in 4th, so no need for 5th or 6th. The 2006 will do it too with stock tires.

Who know's what the car mag drivers did though.

 

[black mamba1]

Excellent post! Thanks!

we

 

[black mamba1]

Excellent post!
THANKS!

WE RULE AGAIN!

 

[sween]

very cool! btw does anyone have that mags photocopied so we can view it on the site??

 

[Boxer12]

Believe it or not, but even more impressive should be the braking number from 100-0, which is reportedly better than an Enzo. Anybody see test results on that?

 

[rcl4668]

Believe it or not, but even more impressive should be the braking number from 100-0, which is reportedly better than an Enzo. Anybody see test results on that?

I believe the C&D test had 70-0 braking in 150 ft for the Viper and 148 ft for the Z06. Don't know about 100-0.

/Rich

 

[Nader]

Why isnt the Viper running circles around the vette? Is it just me or do more people think that the Viper should be significantly faster then the vette?

 

[rcl4668]

First, at least using the C&D results, .2 sec difference from 0-60 is significant. When you are talking about improvements in 0-60 at these levels and speeds, I believe the law of diminishing returns applies.

For perspective, two of the few cars on the planet that can still go faster than the 08 Viper are the much-revered Ferrari Enzo and Bugatti Veyron. The Enzo is conservatively rated at appr. 650 hp, yet can only go another .2 sec faster to 60, 3.3 sec versus 3.5 for the Viper. Likewise, for the Veyron, it requires an additional 401 hp just to go .5 sec faster than the Ferrari at 2.8 sec, and this is the current pinnacle of acceleration (for production cars at least). Further, the Viper's competitors Z06 Enzo etc. benefit from traction or stability control. The reality is that without electronic aids, as the hp goes up in the Viper, it will require higher levels of driver skill to balance traction with horsepower/torque.

And you know what? I kinda like that.

/Rich

 

[InjectTheVenom]

GODDANGIT I went to look for C&D this morning but didn't see the Viper in the september issue!

 

[Vipermann]

GODDANGIT I went to look for C&D this morning but didn't see the Viper in the september issue!

October issues.

 

[Manatee]

Thanks for posting.
What did the text of the Motor Trend article say when comparing both cars?

 

[Nader]

First, at least using the C&D results, .2 sec difference from 0-60 is significant. When you are talking about improvements in 0-60 at these levels and speeds, I believe the law of diminishing returns applies.

For perspective, two of the few cars on the planet that can still go faster than the 08 Viper are the much-revered Ferrari Enzo and Bugatti Veyron. The Enzo is conservatively rated at appr. 650 hp, yet can only go another .2 sec faster to 60, 3.3 sec versus 3.5 for the Viper. Likewise, for the Veyron, it requires an additional 401 hp just to go .5 sec faster than the Ferrari at 2.8 sec, and this is the current pinnacle of acceleration (for production cars at least). Further, the Viper's competitors Z06 Enzo etc. benefit from traction or stability control. The reality is that without electronic aids, as the hp goes up in the Viper, it will require higher levels of driver skill to balance traction with horsepower/torque.

And you know what? I kinda like that.

/Rich

I understand the 0-60 issues however I am talking quarter mile and 0-140. The viper with 100 horsepower advance should be kicking vette butt.

 

[rcl4668]

I understand the 0-60 issues however I am talking quarter mile and 0-140. The viper with 100 horsepower advance should be kicking vette butt.

Oh, I understand your point better now. I guess it depends on what you mean by "kicking vette butt." The good news is that all of the review so far (Edmunds, C&D, Motor Trend) show the Viper beating the Z06 in the quater mile. Again, though, some of the same points I mentoined above still apply: 90 extra hp is a lot but it may not translate to a huge difference in times.

/Rich

 

[SnakeEye]

Based on the initial reviews in the handling dept Motons will still be a good bet.

 

[SuperBee364]

I understand the 0-60 issues however I am talking quarter mile and 0-140. The viper with 100 horsepower advance should be kicking vette butt.

For some reason, Dodge chose yucky gears. I guess they wanted that 200 mph top speed more than they wanted to rule the 0-60 and 1/4 mile times. The Vette has the gearing advantage. Drop equiv/better gears in the Viper, and watch the venom kill the Chevy.

 

[Alexarz]

So far, the '08 Viper seems to be a performance disappointment. However, lets keep in mind that the company is dangling on death row and their budget has to be affecting how much research and development goes into the Viper. All I can say is, I am damn glad I bought an '06, which is a lot more mod friendly (specifically turbo systems). Considering that, with all the tire, hp, differential hype, the '08 is barely faster than the '06, stock, the modability of the '06 makes it a great choice. On the other hand, my guess is that the '08's power advantage will show up more on roll ons than out of the hole. I don't know about most of you, but most of my automobile confrontations take place in highway roll ons. In my opinion, Dodge failed in one area that is the cause of this '08 disappointment; WEIGHT. If I can remove 150 pounds from a Viper, why can't Chrysler?
Another point of consideration is how none of this affects the desirability of the GTS Viper, which can easily be made as fast as we wish it to be. Cars can be made faster but how is anybody ever going to make a vette look anywhere near as good as a GTS Viper?

 

[Nader]

Okay after i took all the numbers in prespective and caught this posted on the Alley, the Viper did in fact blow away the vette from 0-140. This is calc of the distance between cars at 140mph.


140 mph x 5280 = 739200 feet per hour
/ 60 = 12320 feet per minute
/ 60 = 205 feet per second @140 mph.

The coupe is about 14.5 feet long so....205 feet / 14.5 = 14.16 car lengths

That my friends is an ass whipping.

 

[SnakeBitten]

Im still a bit dissapointed that it doesnt rend the Z06 limb from limb..All of us. including some Z06 folks were expecting at least a decent beatdown......After absorbing most of the test results and the overall picture that is coming into view it seems like a letdown...Yes its faster than the Z06 but not by much...Why the 3.07 gearing???Why not at least 100lbs less weight especially since owners have lost more than that with ease on the previous Vipers? Did they not test the final product against the Z06 and saw that it wasnt as big of a statement as it should have been??? I dont get it...Oh and where the hell is the supposed 130mph trapping article???I dont think it exists...

Im a fan of both cars but we all expected this Viper to be a total anihilation of this Z06 before the Z07/SS etc comes....At this rate the General doesnt need the SS/Z07...All they need is to give the current Z06 i/h/e and tune a la LG style and its curtains for this new Snake.....I really see no need for an SS anymore...

 

[Vipermann]

Folks, it's ALL in the gears ... Dodge put 3.07s in the rear to eek out the best possible highway gas milage from that monster V10. The Z06 runs 3.42s. The 1/4 mi time is relatively close between the cars, but notice that the Viper is a full second quicker at 140 mph ... translate: the Viper launch is tricky with the 3.07s, which allows the Vette to remain close, but the Viper walks away from the Vette once the game gets over 100 mph. With 3.33 gears, the Viper will trounce any Z06 in a 1/4 mi test by a wider margin, and I plan that to be my first (and maybe only) mod to the '08 Viper -- I'm not buying the V10 for fuel economy.

 

[viperbilliam]

It's not just the fuel economy - it's also the EPA fuel tax which adds considerably to the price of the car. What's so important about "anihilating" the Z06?

 

[caseyse]

Why not at least 100lbs less weight especially since owners have lost more than that with ease on the previous

Keeping the costs down, I think DC did a great job maintaining the Viper`s weight. The '08 Z06 actually gained 32lbs., despite GM saving 20++ lbs. (?) moving from aluminum to a new magnesium K-member ('07 3,130 '08 3,162). Much of this added weight came from the TR-6060, which is much heavier than the T-56. Fully optioned, the '08 Z06's new upgraded interior and 3LZ options add even more weight over the 07 Z06.

If one were to take a Z06 and upgrade the suspension, calipers/rotors, wheels/tires, transaxle, etc. to match those on a Viper, they would be adding quite a bit more weight to the Z06, approaching the weight of a Viper - less the 160 lbs. the Z06 lost from the base Vette, as a result of the aluminum chassis. At 3,400 lbs., the Viper is a light weight to all other cars having 500 hp (near its price range). The Z06 is a one-of-a-kind fly weight, at the expense of some durability on the track.

 

[Warfang]

Okay after i took all the numbers in prespective and caught this posted on the Alley, the Viper did in fact blow away the vette from 0-140. This is calc of the distance between cars at 140mph.


140 mph x 5280 = 739200 feet per hour
/ 60 = 12320 feet per minute
/ 60 = 205 feet per second @140 mph.

The coupe is about 14.5 feet long so....205 feet / 14.5 = 14.16 car lengths

That my friends is an ass whipping.

Looks about right. It's all in the proportions. Let's face it, we're strating to hit the walls of physics, not to mention physiology. A fraction of a second is a huge leap nowadays.

 

[Alexarz]

Vipermann, I think you are correct. The gear choice is related to fuel economy. Isn't that a royal fck up on Chrysler's part? When it comes to a Viper, we would all rather pay a little more in gas guzzler tax and have the Viper humiliating the corvulva than get a few more miles per gallon and beat it by hair in the 1/4 mile. I think that Dodge only did 50% of what it needed to do to whip the Z06 and that is the foundation of the disappointment that we are now faced with. Regardless, the Viper is a far better sports car, in my opinion. I just wish it would whip the corvulva's ass in the most recognizable way (speed). Most people do not appreciate the quality of the Viper. In fact, Car & Driver (probably overdosed on crack) actually rated the fit and finish of the Corvette better than that of the Viper. People are morons and cannot be expected to recognize quality like we would want them to. Sorry, but a vette (and I still have 2 of them) is not even remotely in the same class as a Viper, so much so that my last purchase was the GTS in my avatar, rather than an '08 Z06 which I was approved to buy at a local Chevy dealer. And yes, the GTS is a 2000 model (8 years older than the Z06 I could have bought).

 

[Warfang]

Vipermann, I think you are correct. The gear choice is related to fuel economy. Isn't that a royal fck up on Chrysler's part? When it comes to a Viper, we would all rather pay a little more in gas guzzler tax and have the Viper humiliating the corvulva than get a few more miles per gallon and beat it by hair in the 1/4 mile. I think that Dodge only did 50% of what it needed to do to whip the Z06 and that is the foundation of the disappointment that we are now faced with. Regardless, the Viper is a far better sports car, in my opinion. I just wish it would whip the corvulva's ass in the most recognizable way (speed). Most people do not appreciate the quality of the Viper. In fact, Car & Driver (probably overdosed on crack) actually rated the fit and finish of the Corvette better than that of the Viper. People are morons and cannot be expected to recognize quality like we would want them to. Sorry, but a vette (and I still have 2 of them) is not even remotely in the same class as a Viper, so much so that my last purchase was the GTS in my avatar, rather than an '08 Z06 which I was approved to buy at a local Chevy dealer. And yes, the GTS is a 2000 model (8 years older than the Z06 I could have bought).

Wasnt there just a thread where someone changed their gears and didn't get any noticable increase in speed after many timed runs before and after? I would suspect the gearing is to make it easier to control all that power from launch AND fuel economy. The Vette might be able to pull it off because it has optional TC, but all around, it would be harder to the average driver to handle it on a Viper. We can't all be stud drivers.

In the end, the Viper still wins. SRT would need a pentagon-sized budget and an asking price comparable to a veyron to get a under 3sec NA car without TC. This isn't 15 years ago, where all cars were dull and it took the Viper to start the HP war. Most have caught up, and we should relish our moment in the spotlight, even for just a fraction of a second.

 

[SnakeBitten]

Folks, it's ALL in the gears ... Dodge put 3.07s in the rear to eek out the best possible highway gas milage from that monster V10. The Z06 runs 3.42s. The 1/4 mi time is relatively close between the cars, but notice that the Viper is a full second quicker at 140 mph ... translate: the Viper launch is tricky with the 3.07s, which allows the Vette to remain close, but the Viper walks away from the Vette once the game gets over 100 mph. With 3.33 gears, the Viper will trounce any Z06 in a 1/4 mi test by a wider margin, and I plan that to be my first (and maybe only) mod to the '08 Viper -- I'm not buying the V10 for fuel economy.

That makes sense but still dissapointed that fuel economy won out over all out performance.....I mean the Vette still gets much better gas mileage despite its 3.42 gearing so that no excuse........I know the Viper program doesnt have the budget the Vette has but I just wish they coulda dropped at least 100lbs or put in some better gearing or both...Guess we will have to wait for the next gen to see how serious SRT is at keeping the Viper on top...The next Vette is going to be a nasty *****.....

 

[Warfang]

That makes sense but still dissapointed that fuel economy won out over all out performance.....I mean the Vette still gets much better gas mileage despite its 3.42 gearing so that no excuse........I know the Viper program doesnt have the budget the Vette has but I just wish they coulda dropped at least 100lbs or put in some better gearing or both...Guess we will have to wait for the next gen to see how serious SRT is at keeping the Viper on top...The next Vette is going to be a nasty *****.....

C'mon... what's with all this whining? Man up, you guys. The next Viper will be even nastier, and the next Vetter nastier than that, then the Viper will be even MORE nasty, etc etc etc...

Enjoy what you got today. Let the engineers worry about tomorow. You ain't getting paid to worry about it, so kwitchurbitchin!

 

[Vipermann]

Wasnt there just a thread where someone changed their gears and didn't get any noticable increase in speed after many timed runs before and after? I would suspect the gearing is to make it easier to control all that power from launch AND fuel economy...

I didn't see such a post, but several tuners have told me that 3.55s really don't lower the Viper's 1/4 mi time because any gain in quickness is given back with additional shifting (when the engine gains rpms to the redline like a knife through butter, then you know you're not putting enough load on the engine for max acceleration) ... but, many believe that 3.33 gears, which not too high, are kind of the 'sweet spot' for the Viper ... they made my '05 (475 rwhp) feel like a sling-shot.