Need Headers. Help me decide

[mbccenter]

M M Headers....

Identical to Belangers except for one big difference....

$1000.00 cheaper..

Not identical at all but yes cheaper

 

[ACPERFORMANCE]

We just added Matt's M&M Headers to a bone stock 2004 Viper. We also added some high flow metal substrate cats, corsa track exhaust and retuned the car. It picked up 52 rwhp in total. M&M Headers fit, and they make power. And Matt's service is second to none.

Todd
A&C Performance

 

[C-Note]

I may be interested in some headers for my Gen2, how much are the M&M Headers?

 

[treesnake]

Not identical at all but yes cheaper

I was referring to the quality...

 

[VicTxV10]

I found this You Tube clip of an 09 with M&M headers. There was no posted hp gains, but it does sound good.


[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6K1jt143ddw&feature=player_embedded[/media]

 

[Catwood]

What's the torque gain on a stock '09 for M&M or Belanger header over the RPM range? Any dyno graphs for comparison.

Todd...did you want so send me some graphics for the Coronado event?

 

[VicTxV10]

Found the dyno sheet for the 09 in the video clip.

2009 Dodge Viper M&M headers Dyno Dynamometer Results Graph
Horsepower: 585.61 HP
Torque: 565.27 ft-lbs

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[VicTxV10]

Says the drivers name for the 09 in video is Viperless. I wonder if it is Keith on here,a.k.a. Viperless. He has an 09 graphite coupe just like the one in the clip.

 

[viperbilliam]

I have kooks. I made a post about them a couple years ago. I like them a lot. The car made 494hp 522tq at the wheels with just the headers, no cats and a corsa....and it sounds mean!

I should have had them coated to cut down on the heat. Some of the flex loom on some wiring has melted, though I have seen the same thing on cars with belangers too which are coated.

Kooks angles the down stream o2 sensor to make more room to help reduce the chance of melting the wires.

Kooks headers are a 5 into 1 witha nice merge collecter and they are one peice so installation is very difficult compared to the other multi piece headers.....never had a leak though.

+1 - I didn't notice any wire melt problems - factory header insulator was retained. Do be aware of resonance problems though.

 

[LifeIsGood]

I wasn't able to find the 'hypercoat extreme' ceramic coating on the site that you listed. Do I need to call them to get information on the product? Is it a spray paint or do the parts need to be dipped? Did it change the color of your headers? Do you still need/use heat shields for your headers?

A couple of things about headers:

Not long after header install, you will notice that your gear shift suddenly becomes VERY hard to get into reverse, and overall gear shifting is difficult. This is because your wiring on the O2 sensor has gotten too close to the headers, the insulation melted, and there is a short, which blows the same fuse that your gear shift reverse lock-out solinoid uses. I can't keep track of the number of times this has happened to people. So, make sure that you insulate the wiring near the headers with heat resistant materials.

On a similar vein, I would highly recommend heat coating on your headers. I used a ceramic coating from HPC called "hypercoat extreme" I was truly amazed at the difference it made in keeping my headers (and engine compartment) cool.

http://www.hpcoatings.com/default.aspx

 

[Viper Specialty]

If interested, I have a set of B&B Stepped Headers [and a B&B Cat-Back as well] that are used, and can cut a NICE deal on.

 

[Kai SRT10]

I wasn't able to find the 'hypercoat extreme' ceramic coating on the site that you listed. Do I need to call them to get information on the product? Is it a spray paint or do the parts need to be dipped? Did it change the color of your headers? Do you still need/use heat shields for your headers?

Here is the link to the hypercoat extreme page:

High Performance Coatings, Inc.

Call them. This is not a spray paint, the parts have to be dipped at their shop. You ship the headers to them, they coat them, and send them back. Takes about a week.

The coating is available in black or grey. I chose black, and I think it looks good.

I do not need heat shields for my headers after the coatings. Prior to the coating, I needed heat shields. I had the headers removed, coated, and replaced, and I ditched the heat shields. The headers never get as hot as they did before. This is one of the few products that worked better than I expected.

 

[Viperless]

Says the drivers name for the 09 in video is Viperless. I wonder if it is Keith on here,a.k.a. Viperless. He has an 09 graphite coupe just like the one in the clip.

That's me.

Here are a few videos from last Monday. Finally got the '09 on the track. First two are in car, third is outside. You can get a pretty good idea how the car sounds.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7FDMGnqUtI[/media]

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOsUFS7kfYg[/media]

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PS0BBpsHUs[/media]

 

[bmw2nv2000]

I just sent an email to High Performacne Coatings about coating some M&M's for me. Does anyone hear know the cost for coating?

 

[ILLSMOQ]

m&m headers come coated...why do yours need to be recoated?

I had a local place do a set of headers and a complete flowmaster 3" exhaust system for a 66 GTO (lots of pipe) a few years ago set me back about 500 bucks...definatly worth it.

 

[bmw2nv2000]

I have not got them in yet and did not realize the M&M's are already coated. But glad to hear they are

 

[Lundqvist]

wait iv seena few people in this thread say you dont gain any HP from headers for a gen 3..

im confused. then why spend 3k on parts and installation for something that gives no gain?

 

[Twister]

NO BETTER WAY THAN TO LOOK AT THIS LIST OF WHAT PEOPLE DYNOED WITH WHAT


made a couple of revisions as of 6JULY2010


NAME-Steve B
YEAR-2003
RWHP/RWT-534/557
TYPE DYNO-Dyno Dynamics
MODIFICATIONS-KN filters...American raceing headers...Corsa exhaust...A&C SCT tune
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZRzAwFqOy8&playnext_from=TL&videos=xaBtHBk8JzY[/media]


NAME-Dipapa
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-521/538
TYPE DYNO-Dyno Dynamics
MODIFICATIONS-KN intake...headers...no cats...VEC3 tune...67mm throttle body...light weight flywheel


NAME-Dimitrios
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-513/569
TYPE DYNO-Mustang
MODIFICATIONS-Ab's quality wires...3" Corsa...no cats...K&N Cold Air...ROE SCT Flash


NAME-Copperhead245 "Ron R"
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-508/522
TYPE DYNO-Mustang
MODIFICATIONS-Kn filters...x metal throttle body...autolite XP985 spark plugs...Big Brakes Daves under drive pulley...corsa exhaust...SCT tune

NAME-MikeR
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-508/522
TYPE DYNO-???
MODIFICATIONS-green filters...m&M headers...Corsa exhaust...no cats..Big brakes Daves under drive pulley...X metal throttle body...DC tune...XP985 spark plugs

NAME-Bandit3
YEAR-????
RWHP/RWT-507/???
TYPE DYNO-???
MODIFICATIONS-Bellangers...3 inch pipes...no cats...Roe SCT tune...Roe single plate throttle body...K & N air filters


NAME-Gonabite
YEAR-2006
RWHP/RWT-499/550
TYPE DYNO-Dyno Jet
MODIFICATIONS-American raceing headers..High flow cats...B&B cat back exhaust...SCT tune


NAME-Shandon
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-492/517
TYPE DYNO-???
MODIFICATIONS-Balanger Headers...Corsa exhaust...No cats...BBK throttle body...KN filters...AB wires...Chromoly Flywheel...VEC3 tune


NAME-Trymyz
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-491/485
TYPE DYNO-Dyno Jet
MODIFICATIONS-No cats...KN intake...VEC3 tune


NAME-Dragon rider
YEAR-2003
RWHP/RWT-490/525
TYPE DYNO-???
MODIFICATIONS-corsa exhaust...high flow cats...KN intake...sct tune


NAME-Flyntgr
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-490/525
TYPE DYNO-???
MODIFICATIONS-Green filters...Headers...cat back exhaust...high flow cats...VEC3 tune...170 degree thermostat


NAME-Reggie
YEAR-???
RWHP/RWT-490/523
TYPE DYNO-Dyno Jet
MODIFICATIONS-KN filters...headers...cat back exhaust...VEC3 tune


NAME-Vinny2
YEAR-2006
RWHP/RWT-482/520
TYPE DYNO-Dyno Jet
MODIFICATIONS-KN intake...Mopar exhaust...VEC3 tune


NAME-Nader
YEAR-2004
RWHP/RWT-482/511
TYPE DYNO-Mustang
MODIFICATIONS-corsa exhaust...single blade throttle body...KN filters...DC tune


NAME-Viper Specialty
YEAR-2004
RWHP/RWT-480/520
TYPE DYNO-???
MODIFICATIONS-corsa exhaust...high flow cats...Vec2 tune...RC1DECC spark plugs


NAME-Yelloh
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-479/528
TYPE DYNO-???
MODIFICATIONS-Bellanger headers...high flow cats...SCT tune


NAME-Twister
YEAR-2003
RWHP/RWT-476/512 SAE...491/529 STANDARD
TYPE DYNO-Dyno Jet
MODIFICATIONS-KN intake...Arrow roller rockers...no cats...titanium exhaust...Findanza light weight fly wheel...Big brake Dave's underdrive crank pulley...Viper Specialty SCT tune


NAME-GripforceSRT10
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-475/???
TYPE DYNO-???
MODIFICATIONS-corsa exhaust...high flow cats...findanza light weight fly wheel...170 degree thermostat...DC tune


NAME-Mark Guolinos
YEAR-2006
RWHP/RWT-472/479
TYPE DYNO-Super Flow
MODIFICATIONS-American raceing headers...high flow cats...corsa exhaust...SCT tune


NAME-BlueBatmobile
YEAR-2006
RWHP/RWT-470/514
TYPE DYNO-???
MODIFICATIONS-American raceing headers


NAME-B767Driver
YEAR-2006
RWHP/RWT-470/477
TYPE DYNO-???
MODIFICATIONS-Bellanger headers...KN intake...no cats...cat back exhaust


NAME-1dumpedviper
YEAR-???
RWHP/RWT-461/480
TYPE DYNO-Dyno Jet
MODIFICATIONS-comp coupe exhaust...dc tune...170 degree thermostat


NAME-Pteam
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-460/497
TYPE DYNO-Dyno Jet
MODIFICATIONS-KN intake...corsa exhaust


NAME-Ibstone
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-460/470
TYPE DYNO-Super Flow
MODIFICATIONS-Bellanger headers...high flow cats...cat back exhaust...3.73 gears...SCT tune


NAME-Dman
YEAR-2003
RWHP/RWT-456/487
TYPE DYNO-???
MODIFICATIONS-KN intake...Corsa exhaust


NAME-Texas venom
YEAR-2004
RWHP/RWT-454/474
TYPE DYNO-???
MODIFICATIONS-KN intake


NAME-Canyon707
YEAR-2004
RWHP/RWT-443/465
TYPE DYNO-???
MODIFICATIONS-KN intake...Corsa exhaust

 

[Twister]

wait iv seena few people in this thread say you dont gain any HP from headers for a gen 3..

im confused. then why spend 3k on parts and installation for something that gives no gain?

HERES MY UNDERSTANDING FOR HEADERS ON THE GEN3'S

B AND B STEPPED HEADERS ARE WORTH 5-10 RWHP

BELANGERS ARE WORTH 10-15 RWHP

M AND M'S ARE WORTH 10-15 RWHP

AMERICAN RACEING HEADERS ARE WORTH 15-20 RWHP

The gen3's just dont pick up a whole lot...But 15 rwhp from some american raceing headers is the route Im personally going..

The fact is that if you want to hit the 500 rwhp mark then you pretty much have to get headers on your gen3

 

[KNG SNKE]

I run M&M headers and they really make the exhaust sound good. I do have a Roe so my tone is different but I will say I had the Roe with stock manifolds and when I added the headers it brought it down a couple of tones.

 

[ViperGTS]

Where do I get M+M headers? Chuck Tator?

 

[treesnake]

Where do I get M+M headers? Chuck Tator?

Contact Matt at M"M headers. great to work with.
(MBCCENTER) Post #31, in this thread.


I have set on my Gen. 3.....

 

[mbccenter]

You can get them from M&M or from Chuck Tator.

 

[EXHLR8N]

My advice is to call Dan Cragen at DC Performance. He has indepth experience in all these headers, which ones pass smog and which ones increase performance.

Best of luck.