New Owner WANTS MORE POWER !!

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

Hey Folks,

Please help me to make the right decisions regarding upgrades. I have been into drag racing for years, and am looking for best 1/4 mile times with my viper. But I am not looking to go crazy with mods. I want to run on street tires, because I want to be able to drive it on the street and the strip. So here is my questions:
1. What are the largest rear tires and front tire combination that will work on my stock 2002 GTS ACR rims (18's of course), because I want the biggest street tires in the rear for best hook up, best I can find is just 345 in the rear, not much of an upgrade.
2. What is the best roller rocker set up for the vipers, meaning which brand is the best/most reliable
3. What about the Computer upgrade from dodge ??
4. Next, the question that there seems to be more different answers then agreement. What header/hi-flow cats/exhaust combination/set up make the MOST POWER.. I don't care about sound, if it doesn't make me more power, forget it !!
5. Finally, what other BOLT on parts am I missing that MAKE POWER ??

Thanks for everyone's help. I'm going to the 1/4 mile track this Sunday, and then to the dyno shop the first of the week, to set my BASE LINE.

 

[Viperoctane]

Congrats on the car,

345's are the widest you ll find for the stock rims. 1.7 T&D Roller rockers seem to be the best. Choose an exhaust for the sound alone cause you wont gain any horsepower. Most people on the board like Belanger headers, I have hennessey headers and love them. Do a search and you ll find all the answers you want.

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

Thanks for the response. The problem with the searches, is that all the posts I find only cover one facet of what I am looking for. Example, most people deviate from the level of power they receive from the exhaust, and begin to talk about its sound. I only want power information. I have read about the rockers and T&D's seems to be winning the popularity contest.

Being part of the viper family, is an amazing feeling, so thank you to everyone ...

Please keep the responses coming, I have a lot to learn. I know 505hp Porsche's that do high 6's 1/8 mile all day long, and low 10's in the 1/4's (that's what mine did), but don't know vipers yet. I will though !!

 

[J DAWG]

It is 3:30 am so I will chime in. I don't believe the Mopar computer is available anymore and it seems the majority did not have a significant improvement using it.

Exhaust on the creampuffs don't make much hp like the older cars. No need to spend the money on a complete system when you can buy some hi-flo cats and do a muffler delete. Unless you just want headers and forsee the need to move a lot of air then I would wait.

What about a gear swap? I have been told that a 3:55 feels like an extra 60-70 hp. Good luck and feel free to call the tuners on the board during the day(this is my night job).


Almost forgot. Roe makes the VEC 1 which I saw was going on sale. It seems to be a nice PCM. I'm sure there may be some others coming out as well.

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

Thanks. I have heard a lot about changing the diff. with that ratio, but my thought is, WHY try to SIMULATE the extra 60-70hp, when you can just ADD 60-70hp, and then assuming you keep at it (adding hp), it will be self defeating the more power you add. This is because your going to get more and more wheel spin/hop with the 3.53 as you add more and more power. So if I was just looking for a quick fix to my "needs", then that solution would be great, but it would only last for 1/2 a year, because I would have to put the stock one back in, the more I invest in the engine. Thank you again, EVERY intelligent response is appreciated. I might just get a complete 3.53 assembly and bolt it in, just for that short time "simulated" increase, but then will go back to stock as the power increases.

Keep 'em coming please.

 

[Tom Welch]

Welcome,

Good questions.

Do not purchase a gear change if you want to drag race your Viper. This will require a 4-5 shift(once your car is modded for more power) which hurts e.t tremendously. The Mopar computer will not help your e.t either. Your model year car has a camshaft with a different overlap than 96-97 cars and the downside of this is that an exhaust combination that nets 50 hp on an earlier car will only net 35-40 hp on yours with its camshaft profile.

My suggestion for drag racing and street reliability is a "top end" job (heads/cam/exhaust/roller rockers) and a nitrous system. This is unbeatable dragstrip power that enables great 60' times and you will have over 500 rwhp N/A(this equates to 100+ rwhp over stock) and over 750 rwhp on nitrous.

Check out our website for a combination of mods at a very reasonable price that will net you the best performance gain for your dollar investment.

Thanks in advance,

Tom
Http://btrviper.com

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

Thanks Tom. Yes, I agree as my earlier post pointed out. If I am adding more hp (which I am going to), then it becomes self defeating to use the 3.55. But for that guy that wants a quick fix, its great, but not what I'm looking for. I want enough motor to make my 3.07 ACT like its got a 3.55, or hell even 3.77.

Alas, Nitrous is fun, but on a cast piston, not too friendly. Being a creampuff isn't an easy life. Those bad boys are coming out the minute the warranty is up. I like displacement anyway, so its a win win, I have crappy pistons, so good excuse to get rid of them, PLUS I want to BORE it out (only as much is reasonable and safe) and stroke it too. No substitute for displacement. But again, that's WAY later, I want to stick with the NOW. Things that will bolt on, and wont piss Dodge off. So that probably drops Nitrous anyway. I'll check out your sight right now.

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

As a follow up, ring gear ratio is dead, I am in agreement. Lets talk about roller rockers, Dodge ECU (Is everyone in agreement its useless, meaning no real power gain ??) ECU might be a Porsche thing, its just another name for the car's timing computer. Also, there is NO complete HEADER/EXHAUST system for my creampuff that will make any worthwhile power, even as my HP/TQ goes up from other mods ?? Any advantage to bigger throttles ?? (I am ACR, so lets not go down the smooth tubes discussion road, thank you.) I have money sitting im my pocket burning (not a good thing) to get out. But again, only want bolt on, and things that will not void dodge from fixing my car under warranty. After I get my track numbers on Sunday, its on, because base line will be established, and no more reason to wait.

Thank you everyone !! Please keep them coming !!

 

[MES]

With bolt on's your going to get at the most 30-45 rwhp increase. This is tubes, filters, headers, high flow cats, and 3" cat back. Nothing spectacular and you will still be running low 12's or high 11's (if your good) on street tires. Roller rockers may net you a few more HP along with a VEC1 or APEXi (A/F controllers) Your never going to go 10's with street tires unless you have massive HP (600+rwhp) and a good track. I would suggest that if your planning on doing this stroking, boring, heads, cam, and whatever else in the future, that you contact a tuner right from the start and see what they recommend. Otherwise you'll be adding parts now which might need to be changed in the future when you do these major mods, and that's a waste of $$.

To answer your questions
1. Vipers come from the factory with the largest tires made. Increasing tire size is not going to help you, you need a stickier tire. Toyo has a new 18" tire in the proper size.
2. People tend to say T&D rockers are the best, I don't know but at $1,200 I would hope they are.
3. There is no computer upgrade from Dodge that work. Use your stock computer then add the VEC1 or APEXi controller they intercept the MAP signal modify the signal and it tricks the stock computer into changing the A/F and timing advance.
4. If you want to see over Viper 75 dyno numbers listed by year, mods, and rwhp then click on my site below then "dyno results" at the top. Keep in mind you have the "creampuff" cam so only models '99 and newer would be comparable to you.
5. Read tom's post above.

 

[Tom Welch]

Hello Again,

Throttle bodies will not enhance your power without massive forced air induction.

We have several dozen "cast piston" vipers running nitrous..lots of nitrous with no ill effects. Cast pistons (hyperutectic) are actually about 30% stronger than forged, they just can't take as much heat or detonation. Our kits run very conservative on the rich side of the air fuel curve so that the cast piston cars do not have any detonation issues. Check out a few of the dyno graphs and dragstrip videos of a 2001 Viper that just had our headers/exhaust and nitrous system.

Something to consider. Purchase mods that will grow with your Viper as your desire to go faster grows. This stuff brings pennies on the dollar on the used parts market. Our exhaust system works well on Vipers making over 900 HP and our nitrous kits are fully upgradable so that they never become obsolete. Same for our head and cam combinations. In a nutshell, don't spend the same money twice.

Thanks again,

Tom

 

[THEMASH]

Go Balanger Headers and exhaust, no cats. then remove the rain baffle on ur air box. i made 437 up from 406 with those mods.
go T$Ds and heads after that, you should see more then 500rwhp then. one of heffners motor cars ran 128mph in the 1/4 mile. Apex also has the Lethal kits and they make the most power on motor only. you can add BTR NOS to that, and you should be in the mid/high 130s.

dont go 345 rears, u will lose .3 seconds in the 1/4 mile by doing that

ECU from dodge does not do much, not worth it.

 

[SVS Turbo]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by MES:
With bolt on's your going to get at the most 30-45 rwhp increase. This is tubes, filters, headers, high flow cats, and 3" cat back. Nothing spectacular and you will still be running low 12's or high 11's (if your good) on street tires.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Our 550 package will produce 470rwhp with the above mentioned items. Add a SuperProm (VEC1) and get another 20rwhp. Our headers alone will produce 35-40 rwhp. We have never sold a Superprom. Stryker 550

Ron

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

You guys are great, just the information I needed. BTW Tom, I know the difference between cast and hypereutectic. I thought they were just regular cast pistons, glad to hear they are AT LEAST a step up and are hypereutectic (you are sure of that ??) Hypereutectic has a higher silicon content and so its actually a bit more durable then standard cast, and of course, would be more accepting of nitrous, but not as accepting as forged. Ok, so from the tuners, what are the items I should buy NOW, that will NOT need to be replaced later, when I do heads, cam, stroke and bore ?? I see no point in wasting good money, but still want to buy items NOW, that will still work for me later down the road as power increases. The diff. mod is out, so no reason to keep bringing that up.

Again, THANK YOU SO MUCH, you guys are great !! I'll post my times Sunday night, I'm sure they will be horrible.. but who knows.

Keep the information coming.. I already see that T&D's are getting bought on Monday. Got quite a few more dollars to spend, so keep the idea's coming. Thank you !!

 

[Tom Welch]

For now you can compliment your rockers with a complete exhaust system. We were the first Belanger dealer and offer the complete Belanger system for $ 3395.00

BTW, you may only see 3-4 horsepower from rockers as with your cam profile their gain is minimal. The small block chevy mentality needs to be cast aside when considering mods for the Viper v-10. Things like tbs, roller rockers, cat-removal, muffler delete, and air filter change all add up to less than a 15 hp gain. With 450 hp you will not notice this 3% horsepower gain from the approx $ 3,000.00 that you will spend on these mods. Sorry if the truth hurts, but thats it.

Tom
Http://btrviper.com

 

[glenn hofstetter]

Tom is right, Vipers do not respond to modifications like vetts do. Forget all the little stuff and go directly to supercharging. There are several kits and tuners that can help you. Adding 150 hp is very easy, completely safe, is on all the time and is a "sleeper" on the street. This is a major change for around $10,000 maybe less.

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

Thanks Tom.

So far, I have my list to include a full 3 inch exhaust system, which includes high flow cats, headers and mufflers. And either Arrow or T&D rockers. I have John Hennessey's price for complete exhaust and rockers, please feel free to email me yours, or post it here, whatever your most comfortable with. I will do more after these "core" items are complete. I assume the performance between your exhaust system ( and Hennessey's is comparable. Both are stainless ??

Let me know. I expect to keep my time line of a "buy order" by EOB Monday. Assuming pricing comes in, in time.

 

[glenn hofstetter]

I'd suggest you reconsider the use of search and look up Hennessey before you send money.

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

Thanks Glenn, but COD is what we agreed on. Its really a tough call though, at a performance standpoint. I keep hearing good things about both. One is stainless, and the other is coated. One uses 5 into 1, and the other uses tri header design. Sure wish I could wave a magic wand, and see what one produced for power on my car and then see what the other produced, and then know which one is best for my car. Isn't life tough ?


At least when I am done with this difficult decision, I can at least know it will not need to be re thought if I move up to super charger or Nitrous. Partial to SuperCharger.

Man, I am quickly seeing that "bolt on" surely isn't the way to make quick Viper Power..

Keep the data coming.. I'm learning fast here !!


Keep the data coming.. I'm learning fast here !!

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

Well, Base Line established. Those **** 2002/03 Z06's are bad. Raced the guy all day, everyone was a good fight (won all but the first one). Anyway, I felt I could have done better, becasue I was finally figuring out how to do it right, but ran out of time. Here is what I pulled though. (on my 2nd to last run)

12.1035 @ 118.95

Stock 2002 ACR !! Now begins the mods !!

 

[Jason-Middle Tennessee]

Also check out the Racing Solutions packages. From the RSI 500 package on up to the RSI unlimited package!! The RSI 500 packages will give you 540 HP for just alittle over 10 Grand while the RSI 550 will step you up to 590 HP for around $19,500. Small price to pay for HP like that!! Check out there site at www.racingsolutionsinc.com

Or give them a call at 281-752-9600

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

The Dyno Numbers are in:


Stock 2002 ACR

SAE corrected:

HP 410.4
Tq 450.4

These any good ??

 

[Bugeater]

410 is right on the money. Did you go to True Blue Performance?

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

I went to carolina auto masters. A buddy that I raced against on sunday (the guy with the Red 2002 Corvette Z06) suggested them, because his vette club did a group pull day and he was impressed with the guys. Plus True Blue is a bunch of ford guys anyway.. right ?? !! hahaha.. kidding..