Paxton Supercharger- "Cold Starts" under 25 degrees F

[Axtellboy]

The Paxton Supercharger "Street Owner's Manual" contains a statement (quoted below) concerning "cold starts" under 25 degrees F (Paxton says doing that can lead to "immediate failure").

I never see much (if any) discussion on this restriction, and I'm wondering how "sensitive" the Paxtons really are, and how much "attention" is paid to this restriction.

My Paxton-ized 1998 GTS mostly "sleeps" all winter in an unheated garage with a Battery Tender hooked up, and I've taken care to never start it up when the temp is under 25, so I'm generally not affected by this temp restriction. (If I did want to take a winter drive when it was that cold, I'd plug in the garage space heater for a good period of time, and not park out in the cold for more than an hour or so.)

That said, I could see situations where I'd "like" to do an <25 degree start (for example, needing to move the car without having time to warm up the garage and the supercharger itself, or taking an overnight trip with no heated parking available). Also, this temp restriction isn't just for Vipers, and I'm wondering how the owners of daily-driver Paxtonized vehicles "live with" this restriction (for example, having the car parked all day at work in an unheated space with no block heater outlets).

I'm wondering if some or most people "ignore" this temp restriction? I'm not saying I would do so, and as noted above I'm not impacted much by this restriction, but I'm curious about what people actually do. Any thoughts/comments by you Paxton owners out there? Do any of you that live in colder climates have a daily-driver Paxton-ized vehicle?

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Quote from Manual- "Important Cold Weather Information- In order to achieve the low noise level of Paxton superchargers, Paxton specifies manufacturing procedures that call for minimal internal clearance. Those precise tolerances, however, are not conducive to temperatures below 25 degrees F. Therefore, starting the vehicle in a heated garage and/or employing the use of an engine block heater/aftermarket engine blanket is required when the vehicle is subject to a 'cold start' in ambient temperatures below 25 degrees F. Failure to comply with this may result in immediate supercharger failure and invalidate the supercharger warranty."

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[plumcrazy]

never heard of it.

mine is on ice like yours most of the winter but i definitely have taken it out in less than 25 deg weather. i always start it up and let it get up to temps before i actually move it.

thats probably happened 4 or 5 times since the paxton was installed. NO issues.

 

[GTS-R 001]

It is probably an oil related thing, when it is cold the oil is thick and moves slower, this will starve your paxton of lubricant and cause it to seize, if you are running an oil weight that is conducive to cold starts you should not have a huge problem, the warning is to cover all paxton users

 

[ViperGeorge]

If you had a blower failure due to starting it at temps below 25 how the heck would they know? All you have to say is it was in my heated garage and it just went kaploey.

On a related note, I recently sent my Paxton in to have seals replaced. It was blowing oil out the bypass and the intake tubes were soaked in oil. When they got it they called me to say that it would not be covered under warranty because I "had tampered with it". I went *** it had a two year warranty and was only 1 year old. The blower was shipped to me by them put on the car and was never "tampered with". They claim some plastic seal that prevents pulley removal was missing. I said well then it was missing when it was new. After screaming at the tech and questioning the integrity of their firm he relented and covered it under warranty.

I wonder if they have a policy of denying all warranty claims unless they are sued or unless you go ballistic on them. Reminds me of the movie "The Rainmaker".

 

[mjorgensen Woodhouse]

Paxton does a very goog job of taking care of customers. If they didn't we would have never installed over 165 of these systems. During that time we saw 1 seal failure and it was covered and back to us in 3 days.

It is true if the nose cap is tampered with or removed (not easy to do by the way so I doubt it fell off) they don't have to cover anything so you must have raised a HUGE stink if they covered it anyway.

 

[Axtellboy]

Mark- Like most of your other customers, I don't drive the Viper much in the winter, but do you have a general sense as to how much "attention" Paxton users pay to this 25 degree restriction? (For warranty purposes, I know they "have to," but I sure don't see much discussion about this.) I'm not thinking about doing a "bunch of cold starts," but I'm really just curious whether I should absolutely never do it.

 

[mjorgensen Woodhouse]

I would be more concerned with the intercooler system failing because of freezing up and ruining the pump, condensor or cooler element. With the 0-40 Mobil1 I don't see a real oil flow issue, now at -15 or more I would not tempt fate.

 

[GR8_ASP]

I also have not tested this lower temperature limit. I doubt it has anything to do with th eintercooler for 2 reasons. First the 25F point is lower than that which could cause damage if straight water was used. And secondly they indicate to use antifreeze coolant.

I do not know ther reasoning but canthink of two possibilities:
The first is clearances between the rotating blades and the housing. A supercharger has very small clearances and if the differences in thermal expansion reduce clearances to an unacceptably small level.
The second is lubrication. Paxton uses a mister to mist the lubricating oil into the bearing. Low viscocity may be a limiting factor in that lubrication. The Paxton unit was developed for Vipers with an oil specification of 10w40. Doubtful that they would have assumed all users to use something less viscous such as 0w40. But then again it is doubtful that the difference in oil specification would work here as the supercharger is used in kits for many different makes of cars.

Based on all of that I am guessing it is the internal clearances. But given that it is 6 feet in the air and warm (you don't think I would store Vipers in a cold garage do you) and will not start until spring arrives, I really do not care about the 25F issue.

 

[Viper Specialty]

A couple points;

-There is certainly a safety margin here. -25 or -23 is most likely not ever going to cause a failure. The limit is probably 20 degrees cooler that stated.

-This is not an oil issue, this is a clearance issue internally. Any internal bushings may seize onto their supporting shafts below a certain temparature.

-This also may be a clearance issue related to the inducer and exducer of the compressor wheel. It may begin to contact the housing as the temp drops.

-I have not heard of an actual failure, but that does not mean it is impossible.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

An oil meeting SAE 0W can be safely sucked up an oil pump pickup tube (i.e. not **** an air hole through cold oil in a sump) down to -40F (-40C) and the pour point (temperature at which it will run downhill) is -54F.

 

[AbsolutHank]

An oil meeting SAE 0W can be safely sucked up an oil pump pickup tube (i.e. not **** an air hole through cold oil in a sump) down to -40F (-40C) and the pour point (temperature at which it will run downhill) is -54F.

HOW DO YOU KNOW?!

Kidding, kidding

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

HOW DO YOU KNOW?!

Kidding, kidding

Actually, I could say "I was there!" Texaco participated in an industry program many, many years ago. Each participant constructed a motored engine dyno in a cold room. Several different engine types were used, and each engine had pressure sensors throughout the block. At various low temperatures and cooling rates, the engine was cranked and the oil pressure recorded. At low enough temperatures, the pressure would never rise because the oil in the pan would not slump and fill the hole; kind of like sucking a straw in a milkshake and getting air. After years of technical society review and analysis of all the engine types, oil types, temperatures, and cooling rates, the pass/fail limits of the bench tests used to predict low temperature performance for the SAE 0W, 5W, 10W, etc, were adjusted.

Consumers would not have seen anything, since a 5W40 is still labeled as a 5W40, but today's 5W is safer and better than yesterday's 5W oils. Cool... ! <--

 

[ViperGeorge]

I would be more concerned with the intercooler system failing because of freezing up and ruining the pump, condensor or cooler element. With the 0-40 Mobil1 I don't see a real oil flow issue, now at -15 or more I would not tempt fate.

All I can say is that the pulley was never off the blower and no one took off the seal. They even told me that you have to hammer on it to get it off. All I can assume is they sent it to me this way. It came directly from Paxton. The seals, by the way, were leaking from day 1. I just didn't know enough to say the seals were shot. I did ask a few people about the oily mess and even started a thread here to ask about it. Eventually I got the answer that the seals were shot. When Paxton looked at my blower they also told me my pulley was dented. Pretty sure it wasn't dented when it left here. They charged me over $100 for a new one but never changed it. I had to call back and complain about this as well. So far I am not impressed with their service. The tech essentially called me a liar when I said I did not take the seal off the pulley.

 

[viper spray]

I never saw this , but here in Austin it rarely ever gets that cold.
Good info tho.......

Mine had to be rebuilt due to some leakage after the Warranty was out , of course.