Perception Vipers can't corner

[Viperarri]

Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Just wondering if any of you out there are getting a little tired of hearing "sure its fast, but a Viper can't corner". I know most of it is probably envy and jealousy, but why is there the perception that a Viper can't take a corner? I am by no means a race car driver, but I can tell you that my Rt-10 can corner as well as my buddies Ferrari's and Lambos. My usual response, and it depends on the car that the person is driving, is "you may beat me into a corner, but I will guarantee you, you will not beat me coming out". Is it true, my Viper really can't corner?

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Of course it is not true. Some of the deception comes from the GenI years when the Viper required serious skill to drive fast - better to blame the car than the driver.

The other reason people make comments like that is because they want to pretend they know something...anything, about what they are talking about even if they have little to no experience.

I mean seriously, look at the size of the tires. Anyone who says a car with meats like that can't corner is either a ***** or a track snob.

For the record, I've driven GenI on a track and they are very, very difficult to drive. Fun, but difficult.

 

[dyeguy]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

On top of what Chuck said, you hear about so many Vipers getting wrecked going around a corner. People assume it's because the cars don't corner well when in fact it's because they have so much torque you have to ease off the gas when turning.

 

[MoparMan]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Chuck - out of curiosity have you also driven a gen III on a track? How do you rate it compared to a gen II? Is there as big a jump in ease of driving between the gen II and gen III as there is between the gen I and gen II?

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

LOL

"All I was doin' is going around a corner and all of a sudden the Viper broke loose! Crappy handling car."

LOL

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Chuck - out of curiosity have you also driven a gen III on a track? How do you rate it compared to a gen II? Is there as big a jump in ease of driving between the gen II and gen III as there is between the gen I and gen II?

GenII is night/day compared to GenI

GenIII is night/day compared to GenII

That 600HP 08 is gonna be a monster.

 

[snampro]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

my GenI handles great, better than the brand new 2004 corvette with Z51 handling package I sold to buy it, people just need to learn how to control their right foot and stop being ********.

 

[AviP]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

In it's heyday, the Gen II was the best handling car EVER. Cornering is measured by lateral Gs and in every magazine review, the Gen II stoked the competition. Since then the competition has upped the ante and the Gen III itself has improved upon the Gen II but I'm not sure if there is an absolute winner.

In either case, the cornering is amazing and the difference between 0.95g and 1.00g is mindboggling. I have taken decreasing radius turns at ridiculous speeds and it has given me headaches if I didn't have my morning coffee. What's to say, I love this car's cornering ability.

Of course, old tires, mid-corner bumps, dirt, rain, mid-corner throttle lift, etc can change the dynamics very easily and make the "cornerning" myth a reality.

 

[snampro]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

I've had passengers ask me to stop because their necks were sore.

 

[HARDVIPER]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

MoparMan:
I didn't know they made ACR's in 05? can you post a picture please?

2005 SRT-4 ACR - white

 

[snampro]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

you know its an ACR neon, not a VIPER, right?

 

[Andrew/USPWR]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Unless you've owned a Viper you've probable never driven a car with 500lbs of torque. If your not easy on the trottle coming out of a corner, the 335 Pilots WILL break loose.

 

[ruckdr]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Viperarri,
View this video and decide for yourself.
My car is a 1996 RT/10 (Stock suspension, stock Michelin Pilot Sport street tires).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JeTdFvtiTuA

Is it the car(s)?; is it the driver(s)?; is it the track?; is it the weather?;
is it the......?; is it the.....?
You decide.

Later,

 

[MoparMan]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

MoparMan:
I didn't know they made ACR's in 05? can you post a picture please?

2005 SRT-4 ACR - white

snampro's right - it's a Neon SRT-4 ACR, not a Viper SRT-10 ACR. Nevertheless, there are some photos of ours here.

 

[Andrew/USPWR]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

1996 Dodge Viper reeling in a 2005 Ferrari Enzo. That's what I call USPWR

Also, like the American "Big Band" music

 

[ruckdr]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Andrew,

Also, like the American "Big Band" music

Yes - Count Basie

Thanks Much
Later,

 

[big-n-italian]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Just wondering if any of you out there are getting a little tired of hearing "sure its fast, but a Viper can't corner". I know most of it is probably envy and jealousy, but why is there the perception that a Viper can't take a corner? I am by no means a race car driver, but I can tell you that my Rt-10 can corner as well as my buddies Ferrari's and Lambos. My usual response, and it depends on the car that the person is driving, is "you may beat me into a corner, but I will guarantee you, you will not beat me coming out". Is it true, my Viper really can't corner?

nobody has ever told me that vipers cant corner. besides, how do they define "cant corner"? is it because someone who doesnt know how to drive a car like this can break the rear tires loose and cause it to spin in a corner?

if that is their definition, then tell them that a chevy aveo must be the best handling car on the road!

 

[Asp Man]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Viperarri, I've never heard that, either. Though I imagine you'd have to consider the source, as with anything.
Someone who has this misconception has obviously never driven even or riden in one(I personaly feel that riding in the passenger seat can be more of an eye opener to how well the car handles). And since there are so few around, it is clear as to why. Perhaps it makes them feel big to try to cut something down to size, or to inflate the status of thier weak brand X ride. Maybe whoever says that is hinting for a ride? Either way, you know it's not true so don't worry about it!

 

[viperdude118]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Funny, my boss just said something about My viper not cornering like a lotus the other day. I don't think he has driven anything but his nissan frontier. People like to just pretend to be knowledgeable about things even when they have no clue what they are talking about.

 

[syldogRT/10]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

I drive a Gen1 and love it. Yes, it is a handful and you really should have some track/instruction time if you're going to push an older Viper. But to say the car does not handle is just silly-that's coming from people who do not know how to drive and/or never drove a Viper. Remember, it's not the speed you carry into the corner, it's the speed you carry out! I learned this rule in my early days racing motorcycles and the same rule applies to tracking/streeting.

 

[Madduc]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Well I would say a Viper corners better than an ENZO, saw it on the news yesterday.HAHA

 

[snampro]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Unless you've owned a Viper you've probable never driven a car with 500lbs of torque. If your not easy on the trottle coming out of a corner, the 335 Pilots WILL break loose.

and? nothing more thrilling than controlling a car around a corner in a slide...

I will say nothing drives like a VIPER and you do need to learn throttle control. best to buy a corvette first for training wheels, learn how to drive..


for a turner-ish car the neon is pretty good (better than a civic or anything acura, except the NSX). must respect the performance.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

I would like to hear from someone that has also driven a stock car on a road course - probably the most similar torque (lots) and weight (lots.) Those comments would be another way to put a Viper in perspective.

 

[GR8_ASP]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Gen I's corner just fine. The OEM tires from 92-95 were the cause of many problems. Little grip until well heated. And even then they had almost no feedback of impending slip and snap oversteer. They were very capable, but damn difficult to reach the limit without a serious mistake.

Gen I with newer Pilots or other tires are fine and quite comparable to Gen II.

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

I would like to hear from someone that has also driven a stock car on a road course - probably the most similar torque (lots) and weight (lots.) Those comments would be another way to put a Viper in perspective.

Excellent question.

I've never driven a stock car on a road course but I have driven one on an oval and it was on rails! Not a fair comparo since it was setup for ovals but I'm betting a Cup car would take a stock Viper handling-wise on a road course.

 

[Vic]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

[satire]
I think Enzos must crash very easily. I've seen two of them crashed on the TV, so that means its true. Can't argue with video tape. I haven't seen many Mustangs in similar crashes, so that must mean Mustangs handle better than Enzos.
[/satire]




If some ignorant smart *** talks sh*t, just stay calm, and invite him to go to the track with you. He'll never feel the same way about Vipers again, nor talk out of his *** any further.







.

 

[George Murray]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

ruckdr - next time, just tap Enzo-boy lightly on his rear bumper. He'll point you by so fast you might think it's his middle finger!

I enjoyed watching that u-tube video. That track looks interesting. Close walls, unlike the track I usually use (VIR - lots of BIG grass runoff areas).

If you drive a Gen 1 on the track, absolutely make sure your fuel tank is 100% full. Gen 1s need the weight there for balance.

Will be at VIR the next 3 days. Can't wait!

 

[ViperJames]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

My GEN 1 w/ GEN 3 rims and brand new tires....handles BETTER than my M5 and M3's both did. To boot, I have tracked all 3 cars on the same track, and the Viper was the best. It IS a much more difficult car to drive like Chuck says, nothing is easier to drive the the M5. But once you break her in....the handling and fun is quite unreal. Not tryign to say i wouldn't rather by driving an Enzo aroud the track!!!!

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

I have a Gen 1 that is only slightly lowered and has stiffer springs, but still on OEM shocks. (Maybe compares to an Eibach car?) Other than that, it's well-adjusted with essentially zero dollars spent on "handling."

I'm not a great driver, but at the NY-CT/NJ AX, by placing first my car beat lots of Gen 2 and Gen 3 cars. Another guy in my car placed second.

http://www4.forum.viperclub.org/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=708558&page=1&fpart=5&vc=1

I think all it shows is that a great car can make any driver feel quicker, but a quick time is still dependent upon the driver. Take a look at the latest Viper magazine and see how the lap times of different Viper Days car classes overlap tremendously.

PS: Maybe those old Michelin XGTZs were the defining factor Gen 1 car handling. They had very flexible sidewalls for better grip but had a much different feel than stiff sidewall tires at higher slip angles. Very different from the newer MXX3, PS, or PS2. I used to have some BFG road race tires that were assymetric sidewalls; the inside wall was stiff and the outside was flexible. It made the tire feel "springy" in hard corners; perhaps lucky for me that it was a good introduction to the XGTZ.

 

[ruckdr]

Re: Perception Vipers can\'t corner

Oh, I forgot to mention that I have Tom's big rear brakes. An advantage over the Enzo, I don't know, but certainly a BIG advantage in stopping. Here is what I posted after installing them in 2005:

THANKS TOM,
We finally had a track day here in the Northwest that didn't get rained out. As a result, I was able to really exercise the rear (and front) brakes at Pacific Raceway in Kent, WA (south of Seattle, WA) The car reacted unbelievably, no nose dive, just squatted and slowed down fast. I as able to drive so fast and deep into corners, it was scary at first, until I got the confidence and realized that the car was really different.
The track day was an invitation only day, and I had the pleasure of running with 360 Ferraris, a Porsche Carrera GT (you know the V10, about $500,000), and the thrill of a lifetime at the track, and Enzo Ferrari ($1,000,000+). I have a DVD made from my video camera, following, pushing, actually running all over the Enzo, for several laps around Pacific Raceway (the driver was REALLY poor, and wouldn't let me by). If I can figure out how to post a DVD segment, I will.

Thanks again Tom for the great rear brakes.

You have seen the video, posted above.

Later,