Strange engine heating problem (new)

[Bolt]

I did a search and read up on all the engine heating up issues but did not find anything like what I am experience. Please read help.

Engine heating up at idol and when I jump on it.

I’m running a Paxton SC.
My air/fuel ratio is 15.3 (Good)
No apparent blockage in the exhaust. (Aftermarket setup and free flowing)

I’m not in the red yet but there is a difference in my engine temperature this year from last year. Listed below is what I did.

Last year I put in a 180 degree thermostat
This year here is what I just did:
Tested out the electric fan. I’m putting our 1900 CFM. (Working good)
I took my radiator to the local shop and they flow tested it. (Working good)
I had them tear the radiator apart and clean it out. Some small blockage. (Now working good)
I put in 30 percent antifreeze and Royal Purple water wetter.

I start the engine and turn on the AC. Temperature goes up to the line just be fore the red mark in 5 minutes. This is from a cold engine.

I turn on the heater and when the motor is hot the air should be extremely hot. It’s not.


Is it a possibility I may have a defective thermostat or and impeller slipping on the water pump. The water flow just does not seam to be there.


When I drive this car and I’m putting around the engine temperature stays in the middle where it is suppose to be.

All the testing I have been doing in my garage is with the hood off.

Radiator temprature is running at 190 degrees.

 

[plumcrazy]

you sure of the gauge ?

 

[Bolt]

you sure of the gauge ?

Gage is OK, I doubble checked it with my hand held laser thermometer. I can feel the heat coming off the engine.

 

[Bolt]

Lower and upper heater hose checks at 195 degrees.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

Two quick checks -

the wire on the temperature setting knob has come off the heater core diverter valve and it's not allowing hot water to go through coolant?

Air bubbles trapped in heater core (burp.)

 

[Bolt]

Two quick checks -

the wire on the temperature setting knob has come off the heater core diverter valve and it's not allowing hot water to go through coolant?

Air bubbles trapped in heater core (burp.)

All air is out. I did this with the vent on the t-stat housing.


I am now running gas with ethanol in it. Last year there was no ethanol in my fuel. Could this be the problem?

 

[EllowViper]

Burp the system correctly??

 

[dave6666]

2001 is the year of the iffy water pump. What year is your car?

Doesn't the heater core flow regardless of t-stat condition - whether it is open or closed or not?

 

[Bolt]

2001 is the year of the iffy water pump. What year is your car?

Doesn't the heater core flow regardless of t-stat condition - whether it is open or closed or not?

I have a 1998 GTS.

 

[Bolt]

I just talked to my son-in-law and he is having the same problem with his Mustang. Like myself we see this when the AC in on.

Maybe there is someting going on with the ethanol.

Even my wife's 2001 Grand AM is running hotter.

 

[Fast Too]

That 15.3 A/F isn't under boost I hope

 

[Bolt]

That 15.3 A/F isn't under boost I hope

No, It is at idol 15.1 to 15.3

 

[skeetachya]

Dont know if this is it but my father also put that ethanol in his suzuki hayabusa and it overheated. It only did that when he put that crap in it. He has not put it in there since and the bike is fine.

 

[Bolt]

I'm getting more reports that the Ethanol will make the engine runn hotter.
They say this is my problem.

 

[Qualitywires.com]

Anytime you put a SC on any car it can cause it to run hotter because it's putting a load on the engine. Kind of like running your AC on all the time. More power will generate more heat.

 

[Bolt]

Anytime you put a SC on any car it can cause it to run hotter because it's putting a load on the engine. Kind of like running your AC on all the time. More power will generate more heat.

This is true but this was not happening last year and it did not start getting hotter till I put my first tank of fuel with ethanol in year.

Reality check:
Engine temprature after 10 minutes of running. 220 degrees
top radiator hose 195 degrees
lower radiator hose 165 degrees


I'm tearing the watter pump out tonight. Even if I don't find anything wrong I'm going to try to go to a smaller watter pump pully. Of course change the Serpentine belt too. Anyone out there know where I can get a smaller watter pump pully or what application would fit? I want to reduce the diameter by 1/2 inch.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

I am now running gas with ethanol in it. Last year there was no ethanol in my fuel. Could this be the problem?

Should not. The O2 sensors adjust mixture ratio and the ethanol has a higher latent heat, so it should actually run cooler.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

Reality check:
Engine temprature after 10 minutes of running. 220 degrees
top radiator hose 195 degrees
lower radiator hose 165 degrees

Please clarify this - one hose should be hotter than engine, the other cooler than engine (assuming the engine temp is measured by a guage? )

 

[Bolt]

Should not. The O2 sensors adjust mixture ratio and the ethanol has a higher latent heat, so it should actually run cooler.

I don't know much about this but could the O2 sensors be reading the information incorrectly and either making the car run rich or lean and creading the motor to run differently? Is this why we all see the gas milage decrease with the gas which has ethanol in it? Do we need to have our computers reprogramed to compensate for this as more ethanol is added?

 

[Bolt]

Please clarify this - one hose should be hotter than engine, the other cooler than engine (assuming the engine temp is measured by a guage? )

The 220 came from the guage (Engine temp)
the other two temps came from my hand held laser thermometer at the upper hose and lower hose on the radiator.

 

[dave6666]

Reset PCM time, for new fuel?

 

[Bolt]

Reset PCM time, for new fuel?

Than that is something simple to try. Thank you.

 

[GR8_ASP]

This is true but this was not happening last year and it did not start getting hotter till I put my first tank of fuel with ethanol in year.

Reality check:
Engine temprature after 10 minutes of running. 220 degrees
top radiator hose 195 degrees
lower radiator hose 165 degrees

The delta T across the engine seems high (should be more like 15 F). When are you measuring the hose temps? At idle, while driving or immediately following driving? Is the fan on when you are checking it?

A high delta T across the engine can be caused by low coolant flow rates. So either a pump issue, a restriction (like a stuck thermostat or kinked hose) or something of that nature may be occuring. It can also be caused by excessive heat rejection to the coolant. If your engine is running ok I am doubtful as to that. However, compression leakage to the coolant is a low probability cause (head gasket, erosion of head water jacket, etc).

My guess is on the flow side if the heater performance is poor. Have you checked the aftermarket thermostat operation? That would be my first guess.

 

[Bolt]

The delta T across the engine seems high (should be more like 15 F). When are you measuring the hose temps? At idle, while driving or immediately following driving? Is the fan on when you are checking it?

A high delta T across the engine can be caused by low coolant flow rates. So either a pump issue, a restriction (like a stuck thermostat or kinked hose) or something of that nature may be occuring. It can also be caused by excessive heat rejection to the coolant. If your engine is running ok I am doubtful as to that. However, compression leakage to the coolant is a low probability cause (head gasket, erosion of head water jacket, etc).

My guess is on the flow side if the heater performance is poor. Have you checked the aftermarket thermostat operation? That would be my first guess.

More good information. Fan is working fine. Runs at both low and high speeds. I'll remove the t-stat and test it in boiling watter. I'll also look for obstructions. Maybe run watter from a garden hose thru the engine. I'll also do a compression test to all cylinders. I don't see any unusual compression or vacume in the coolent system. I am running a new radiator cap. 17PSI I still have the ole 195 degree t-stat. Should I put that back in for testing?

 

[dave6666]

More good information. Fan is working fine. Runs at both low and high speeds. I'll remove the t-stat and test it in boiling watter. I'll also look for obstructions. Maybe run watter from a garden hose thru the engine. I'll also do a compression test to all cylinders. I don't see any unusual compression or vacume in the coolent system. I am running a new radiator cap. 17PSI I still have the ole 195 degree t-stat. Should I put that back in for testing?

You can run w/o a thermostat. I just wouldn't do it for very long. The PCM won't like it.

 

[Bob Woodhouse]

You mentioned it heats at idle, the radiator is clean, coolant is good etc.

This is not an ethanol issue, otherwise the entire nation would be overheating since most 91 octane is around 10% which is what I assume you mean by ethanol. The blend yes?

Air in the system is a high possibility and you said you have burped but I would re-do that, the system has been completely apart and you may have trapped air that did not rise the first try.

Remove the water pump if nothing else makes sense, impellers can come loose, altho not common. Yes there was a small rash of them a few years ago.

Air flow, you have no changes in air passing over the radiator, like, the fan is coming on in your garage, you have not opened up an areas around the radiator to allow air to flow around it etc.
Hope you get it fixed, Bob Woodhouse.

 

[dansauto]

turn your heater on and see if that lowers the temp any. If so then you are just no getting enough airflow thru the rad.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

All air is out. I did this with the vent on the t-stat housing.


I am now running gas with ethanol in it. Last year there was no ethanol in my fuel. Could this be the problem?

You Gen 2 guys have modern conveniences, so I didn't know there is a vent on the thermostat housing. Even so, in a Gen 1 the heater core elbow hoses are the high spots and loosening them to bleed air or even filling from there is the "secret' to getting air out. I still vote for burping.

The only other idea is a collapsed hose - the inner lining has separated from the stringy core and is flopped into the coolant path.

 

[Bolt]

Good suggestions keep flowing in. Water pump is 1/2 way out. Working around all the SC stuff is a PITA. But I love what the SC does for me. I'll keep checking things out and report back.

Side note: I heard all gas over 91 octain contains the full 10 percent ethanol. I don't know if this is true but I'll be running high octain in my other cars to test his out for awhile.

 

[Bolt]

Water pump looks like it's in great shape.

Now I'm looking for a water pump gasket on a Friday evening. No luck so far.