Used market flood

[commandomatt]

Lot of questions for those that are purchasing the new Gen V cars. Here's another one.

Are those that are stepping up early trading a current Viper in or buying outright ? Of course also a possibility that they are new to the Viper period.

So if most buyers of the new Gen V's are in fact trading a Viper in, we will in a few months be seeing a tremendous increase in used cars being available.

This could all make it pretty exciting for those that want to get a used one since there will be a whole lot of choices to pick from.

Just a thought.

Matt

 

[JonSav]

I'm not trading... I can imagine there will be a lot more gen 3/4 on the market

 

[ViperSmith]

My 1st Viper

 

[SilveRT8]

I'll be trading my Gen 08, but it's a shame as it's such a nice car.
Sometimes I think that I' m really spoiled to even think about wanting something more !

 

[PDCjonny]

Those that are trading in won't be too thrilled with the trade in values, I sure wasn't.

 

[ferraritoviper]

Purchasing

 

[MoparMan]

I already sold mine in anticipation of the Gen V.

 

[denniskgb]

Ok let's get it straight. This is a niche market. Dodge is not building thousands of vipers. Business as usual, there will be some trades some private sales for the more patient and savvy viper owners....Market flood? Not happening.

 

[Voodoo Rob]

Agreed. Market flood is a very strong term, more like a few more than usual .

 

[johniew398]

I will eventually be selling mine or trading it when and if SRT produces an ACR verson and I like it. And of course, my wife has to like it. She has said
it has to look as bad as the Gen IV ACR I have now.

 

[slysnake]

Ok let's get it straight. This is a niche market. Dodge is not building thousands of vipers. Business as usual, there will be some trades some private sales for the more patient and savvy viper owners....Market flood? Not happening.

A voice of reason. I think if some people are expecting a big price drop in the older models they will be disappointed.

 

[Bobpantax]

Let's see. From the first Viper through the last Gen IV there were how many? A bit more than 25,000 or so - right? About 30% or so are gone due to wrecks. There will be a significant number who will keep the pre Gen V models because they are purists who will not go nannytech, etc. The Gen IV and Gen V are also not easily modded to produce higher power levels. Of course there is the "I have to have the new one right now" group but not all of them will trade or sell their current Viper or Vipers. The same wealth that allowed them to immediately buy the new Gen V, in some cases will allow them to also keep their current Viper or vipers. The new car is attracting a considerable number of people who have never owned a Viper before. Bottom line. I think that there may be a bump in used car supply initially but i expect that there is going to then be a strong demand in the used car market for what some will see as "the true Viper" - the mean, raw, aggressive, driver's car that made many of us Viper fanatics.

 

[SADVIPER]

Maybe some people never had the money before and they just want a Viper, it could be any generation right now but surely the majority will shoot for the newest! It sure look like it attracted the attention of some of the purists, since it is still the snake we know, only with a new skin.

 

[09 Venom]

I already have had 3 offers from people who know me and know how i keep my cars. And the offers were pretty good i think. ranging from 65 to 71K. this would be a private sale though and NOT a dealer trade in.
The dealer i ordered my gen V from also wants it on a trade, althugh i have a VON number and priced order confirmatuion he said we will talk price when i take delivery. i have bought from this dealer in the past so not too concerned.

 

[Coloviper]

Those that don't think the previous Gen used Vipers market will be greatly increased in the Spring are in denial.

 

[Smog Dog]

My dealer commented that more buyers who already owned Vipers were interested in trading than in the past. Who knows why? Maybe the higher cost for the Gen V. There will be a good selection of used Vipers, except for the Gen V, available in the Spring.

Bill

 

[bluesrt]

08 to 10 will hold strong numbers

 

[01sapphirebob]

I would be selling my GEN IV to get a V privately. Able to get the most out of it this way. Dealers have to make money to so they won't give me on trade what I would be looking to get for it in a private sale which is fine. I considered selling my GEN II as well but that is NOT an option at this point. I can't let that car go.

 

[commandomatt]

Ok let's get it straight. This is a niche market. Dodge is not building thousands of vipers. Business as usual, there will be some trades some private sales for the more patient and savvy viper owners....Market flood? Not happening.

I certainly understand that it is a niche market. thats part of the reason I own one.

Having said that, the term 'market flood' was intended to be relative to what has been available in the last couple of years. I am not suggesting that it will be a 'Corvette' type availablility. Just that I would expect it to be far more than what we are used to.

If 25 to 30% of the generantion V buyers will trade in their old Vipers, which is pretty resonable to expect, then there will be several hundred cars entering the used market. Anybody suggesting that that is not a big influx of cars, based on what is normally there, is not getting it.

Now, if most new buyers are holding on to their current cars or coming in from a 'new' market, then we wont see the increase I mention.

I however think, and this is not a bad thing, that there will be a fair amount of great Vipers available next year and this will open the door for more people to get into this niche segment. All good for the future strenght of the car.

Matt

 

[Smog Dog]

I would be selling my GEN IV to get a V privately. Able to get the most out of it this way. Dealers have to make money to so they won't give me on trade what I would be looking to get for it in a private sale which is fine. I considered selling my GEN II as well but that is NOT an option at this point. I can't let that car go.

Best scenario here in Ohio, with our tax laws, is to find your own buyer and run the sale through your dealer. Perfectly legal and you will save several thousand in sales tax. But I'm sure you already have thought of that!

Bill

 

[01sapphirebob]

Best scenario here in Ohio, with our tax laws, is to find your own buyer and run the sale through your dealer. Perfectly legal and you will save several thousand in sales tax. But I'm sure you already have thought of that!

Bill

I had not thought of that. How would this work? Is this consignment?

 

[Bobpantax]

Unless your state's sales tax law is different, the dealer would have to buy the car from you and resell to your buyer. Sales tax would be due from the dealer on the difference between what the dealer paid you for the car and what the buyer paid the dealer. But, I would check your local sales tax law and regulations to make sure that the sale to the dealer is exempt when the subsequent sale is prearranged. There may be a "step transaction" rule that prevents the use of this procedure to avoid sales tax.

 

[ViperGeorge]

Unless your state's sales tax law is different, the dealer would have to buy the car from you and resell to your buyer. Sales tax would be due from the dealer on the difference between what the dealer paid you for the car and what the buyer paid the dealer. But, I would check your local sales tax law and regulations to make sure that the sale to the dealer is exempt when the subsequent sale is prearranged. There may be a "step transaction" rule that prevents the use of this procedure to avoid sales tax.

The buyer generally (at least in all the states that I'm familiar with) has to pay sales tax. Either to the dealer if sale is through a dealer or to the Motor Vehicle Agency upon registration. The buyer ALWAYS gets hosed. The seller though can generally save sales tax on the value of the trade if the car is traded for another car via a dealer. The value of the trade offsets the purchase price in many states thereby saving the tax. I think that the Smog Dog is right at least in some states.

I am told that if you set up an LLC in a state like Montana you can avoid sales tax and vehicle inspection. Some other states do the same thing I think. I hear that people do this to save tax on everything from boats to cars to RVs. Google Deer Creek Corporate Services in Montana for more info. Would this work?

 

[denniskgb]

This is called "dealer courtesy" deal. For example you are buying their car for lets say $100k instead of trading your old car you have a buyer for $50K. You come to the dealer with your buyer (hope his credit is good unless he is paying cash) and two transactions take place. Your are getting your car and your buyer is purchasing your old ride for the price you had had agreed to. Now, it is a win - win situation since the sales tax is minimized drastically (versus you getting $42K for the trade for example). Now the only way the dealer is making money on this second transaction is their doc fee (different dealer to dealer) and finance rate for the buyer.
Here is the deal, pay attention: If you have excellent credit and the dealer is arranging financing for you their "buy" rate versus what they will tell you as their finance rate has normally %2.5 to #% built in to it. So if they tell you "congratulations welcome to the sale you term is 75 myth @ 5.75%" i can rest assure you can shop for a better rate or just drop a hammer and chizzle it down to 3.25%.
hope this was of any help.
i am a license used car NJ dealer.

 

[Paul Hawker]

Not a flood, but just a return to a normal market.

It is normal for people to trade in their old cars when buying a new one. This is a normal marketplace.

Since the new Viper has a significant price increase over the previous generations, there might even be a flood of new buyers into the used marketplace, that wish to drive a Viper, but not willing to buy a new one.

I would imaging that, with the prices of the new Vipers going up, the value of the used marketplace would also be going up. If you want to be able to drive a Viper, you will need to pay the price.

Since there will most likely be a pretty long wait for ordering new Vipers, with the new cars only trickling out of the factory at first, the current owners will have plenty of time to wait for a good offer, and be in no rush to sell their current cars.

This situation will repeat itself when the Vert is released, and again when the next ACR is is released...normal market.

Right now, there are not very many Gen IV Vipers available in the used marketplace. Rarely are even more than one of each color advertised.

Hoping for great deals, just around the corner, will keep you looking around the next corner for many many years to come.

 

[Bobpantax]

Yes. Correct. I should have phrased that more clearly. The dealer charges the buyer the sales tax and remits it to the applicable Department of Revenue.

The buyer generally (at least in all the states that I'm familiar with) has to pay sales tax. Either to the dealer if sale is through a dealer or to the Motor Vehicle Agency upon registration. The buyer ALWAYS gets hosed. The seller though can generally save sales tax on the value of the trade if the car is traded for another car via a dealer. The value of the trade offsets the purchase price in many states thereby saving the tax. I think that the Smog Dog is right at least in some states.

I am told that if you set up an LLC in a state like Montana you can avoid sales tax and vehicle inspection. Some other states do the same thing I think. I hear that people do this to save tax on everything from boats to cars to RVs. Google Deer Creek Corporate Services in Montana for more info. Would this work?

 

[v10enomous]

There's going to be a ton of C6 Corvettes on the market at the same time too with the C7 reveal scheduled for 1/13/13.

 

[Coloviper]

Don't see prices going up for used GEN I-IV Vipers with new GEN V on the horizon. The new GEN V did not suddenly fix the faults (to a small group; positives) of the older GENs. If the demand was there for that type of specific car, then the older GENs would all be selling like hot cakes and they are not, at least not for big bucks on the used market.I mean you can get decent no stories GEN I with say 40,000 miles for low $20ks. New car will not affect GEN IVs either. While a dedicated group of owners, they did not sell well and not many were made for a reason on top of other circumstances at Dodge. The appeal is just small unfortunately. I am not saying I don't like GEN IVs. I am saying I like them all but it is clear my tastes in cars are not the norm which is why Saleens and Vipers are the ones that have been in my ownership not vettes and cameros, etc.. Neither Viper nor Saleen brand has done well on resale or keeping their value as a whole.

Part of the problem is they are producing better and more powerful cars toping themselves every year. Better at least how the mass of sheeple see it. Until there are a huge contingent of Hybrid or Electric cars out there (something major to change the perspective and make people want to have Vipers becuase nothing like that is being produced again) the Viper will depreciate like it has. No GENs are amune. GEN V may be amune if it is has performance numbers that ar unreal and they limit production to say 1,000 coupe and 1,000 verts and only make it for 3 years, but that is not what will happen.

Agree on the flood of vettes when new one is released. Would not want to be a vette owner when it happens as it will be a buyers market. It will be same for Viper, a buyers market, except for the GEN V and C7.

 

[wikkid]

The Viper market will be loaded with cars come spring, period. There is also the savings on tax difference which makes the trade more tollerable. Either way your bending over....

 

[Camfab]

This is really confusing me. Your telling me that if you trade a car in on a 100K car and your car is worth 50K, you only pay 50K in taxes? I know that's not the case in CA. The 50 K car is considered a down payment, your still buying a 100K car and your going to pay 100K worth of taxes, period! I see no savings in your idea of selling the car through the dealer. How is that a win win situation. The only win is that your getting more for your car because it's really private party. That's no news, so where's the win win?

All Gen Vipers will drop once the new car is on the market like every car before and every car in the future. Gen IV's will take a big hit and older Gen's will drop in lesser proportions depending on age.