VERY FRUSTRATED!!! HAVE one last post before i loose it.

[DVSGTS]

It may be faulty or just stuck. See if you can clean it out a little, clear the codes, hook it all back up, and see if the code returns. This is assuming you can even get it to idle. The IAC does just that, controls idle air flow. This is where a scan tool helps again, easy to clear codes. Otherwise, you have to pull the pos battery terminal off and ground it for a few seconds. That will reset the ECM.

 

[BOTTLEFED]

the IAC controls air in the intake at idle, kind of like an idle air adjustment on a carb

the code may have been set if you disconnected the connector/harness while the battery was still connected or if you didn't get it connected fully
thus, there may not be anything really wrong with the IAC itself

disconnect and reconnect the harness a few times and make sure it is seated well
then clear the code and check to see if it comes back

 

[AZTVR]

1) The car starts and idles but smokes like a freight train.
2) During quick taps at the throttle it will sometimes take it but then almost stalls.
3) When trying to rev the motor it sometimes sounds healthy but other times sputters really bad and doesnt want to rev.

I took it for a short short drive just to see if it would clear up after resetting the computer and just babying it it didnt run to bad except when youd let off the throttle it would want to almost cut off. Also while driving it i left a smoke cloud behind me that killed every insect in central va.

I pulled the idle air control valve plug out to see if that would make any difference ( checking to see if it would run worse) but it ran the same so i tried to clean it with electic parts cleaner and now it will start up run a few seconds and then shut down. After it shuts down it will then start back up and do the same thi g run a few seconds then shut down. I even tried to hold the rpms at 2500 one time but it still cut off.

I realize that you are in frustration mode, and you did answer my question replying that it ran the same after disconnecting and resonnecting the IAC valve connector; but what you posted above seems to say otherwise. I'm just asking, in case there might be an intermittent in the IAC valve solenoid wiring. I know of this issue on a totally different manufacturer's vehicle; but that failure mode seems like it would just affect idle speed to me. Maybe Viper is totally different.

 

[1TONY1]

I just need to know where to start to look for problems or need guidence on what to check bc i just dont have a clue. Also with the vec 3 im just running a base map that sean sent me on a card if that matters.

Is that a program he sent with the Vec3 or one you were running with the Vec2 ?
A lot of your problems had/have nothing to do with the s/c ... don't give up yet.

The compression tester.....we have standard spark plugs. Any tester I have seen works without even using adapters for different plug sizes....check that out again.

 

[Nates GTS Viper]

With the compression tester its not that it wont work its just that with the way its made i couldnt get a wrench in to tighten it up.

Also with the idle control valve i did clear the code and tried to clean it a little but when i started it up again it came back.

As far as the tune on the vec3 im not sure how its tuned i just gave sean the info on the car and got him to send me two cards one with 6 degrees ret. Timing and one with 9 degr. Ret. Timing. Where as with the vec 2 i had him make me a card 1 for just pump gas and 1 for water/**** injection and both of those seemed to work just fine. They ran a little rich during wot but i figured that would keep the motor safe until i could get the car to a dyno and tune it.

I dont mind calling sean and seeing about getting another tune made up if that may be whats causing the issue just let me know what you all think.

 

[RobZ]

I've never seen a VEC installed so I'm not sure if it's a piggyback controller or what but I would suggest removing it altogether and run with the stock ECM to see if the car will start and idle. DON'T drive it around or at least don't get into boost but this will help solve the problem by elimination so to speak.


Rob

 

[RTTTTed]

I experienced your problems. Matter of fact, I burned out MY Vec 2, borrowed the one off of sean's car and burned that one out as well. ($70 to fix). I upgraded my Vec2 to 3 firmware and added the IAT. Problem was bad connections! Bad power connections caused the Vec2 to burn out and it seems that I need to reset the program every so often (another loose connector?). Reload your program and see if that improves things. If someone nearby has a simial set up try their program in your vec3. Try a Vec swap.

The blue smoke is probably fuel (too fat). The wire in the harness (L side of engine beside power steering pump) that fires the injector was disconnected for awhile and my car used 1/4 tank of gas in 7 miles. Flames rose over the rear spoiler Before I discovered the disconnected wire at the harness I disconnected the injector harness from #10 so that I could drive it home. Sean suggested to me that I use a stethescope to make certain that the injectors were clicking (not stuck). To test injectors vs. tune I pulled my air intake tubes and fuel rails then switched injectors to different cylinders. Same cylinders running too fat at idle, after I switched injectors around proved problem was tune and not faulty injectors (dyno mechanic told me to buy 3 injectors).

I suggest using a thermometer to check exhaust temps at the exhuast ports of each cylinder. You'll need to remove the top of the heater to do that.

Ted

 

[RTTTTed]

Have you tried to reset the inital General parameters? I'd take my instructions and try programming the base/inital tune again. If you make a mistake there it'll never run correctly.

What injector offset are you using? I've found mine to work best at 63%.

Just be happy that the Vec is set to go rich instead of lean. I think it's a design parameter that saves engines by going fat instead of lean.

Ted

 

[Nates GTS Viper]

to tell the trueth i havent been able to hook my computer up to the vec to check anything cause i have vista and not xp. i just had sean do the tune after talking to him on the phone and had him mail me the cards and thats what im using. ive tried both but they run the same since i cant really drive it. also car went through 4 gallons of gas in about 4 minutes of idling and a little playing with the throttle to keep it running.

 

[RTTTTed]

When you initally instal the Vec3 you have to set which Generation (year) of your car, etc.

I used my XP to tune my car, then asked Larry Macedo to load the Vec program into my color keyed widescreen (fits into seatback pocket) acer laptop and it has a program that locked him out of installing the Vec program. POS new computer!!! It often shuts off the webpages I'm using, erases whatever typing I was doing, etc. - all by itself. Gonna get an expert to reset my operatinbg system to XP as Vista *****!!! I should ask for a refund for this laptop that sets it's language to French etc. all by itself. POS. Cal Sean and check what I said, but the 3 Vec instals I did on my car needed the inital setup to work.

Double check your Vec wires in that connector I mentioned (the wire remove and add) from the connector is written in the Vec instal instructions. Remove the extra harness that fits in between the stock connectors for the Vec injector box and see if it runs the same. Your description is exactly how mine ran while the Vec inj. harness was unhooked from the stock harness.

Ted

 

[plumcrazy]

also car went through 4 gallons of gas in about 4 minutes of idling and a little playing with the throttle to keep it running.

i hope it didnt wash the rings then. might wanna change that oil.

 

[dave6666]

An interesting thread for sure. Good luck solving your issues. And another reminder for me not to screw with modding my engine. I got burned out just trying to get rid of the header O2 preheat codes.

 

[2MANYTOYS]

An interesting thread for sure. Good luck solving your issues. And another reminder for me not to screw with modding my engine. I got burned out just trying to get rid of the header O2 preheat codes.

Dave,
If it's done right you won't have any problems especially with the roe setup. I've had all three major setups Roe, Paxton, and turbos. All can be problematic if not done right. The key is to have a good tuner do it right the first time. Once you have boost on your car you will never want to drive a stock Viper again.

 

[Fatboy 18]

An interesting thread for sure. Good luck solving your issues. And another reminder for me not to screw with modding my engine. I got burned out just trying to get rid of the header O2 preheat codes.

Yep have to agree with Dave on this, I don't mind doing light mods but engine tunes etc are out of my league, its interesting to hear the feedback but if the basics are wrong then you have no chance other than getting someone over to help you through it! On a serious note, I would be very concerned about using that much fuel! The fuel can easily find its way down the boars and mix in with your sump oil! You could do some serious engine damage if your not careful!
Are there not any good tune shops near your area? Surely there must be some other Viper guys near you that know there stuff?
I wish you the very best of luck, when we get stuck in the UK we call Chuck Tator!

Best of luck
Mark

 

[1TONY1]

With the compression tester its not that it wont work its just that with the way its made i couldnt get a wrench in to tighten it up.

Gotcha, You do not need to get a wrench on it. Twist the hose by hand and it will snug up just fine against the o-ring that should be on the fitting. Spin the engine about six revolutions to get a good reading. If you are going to spin it with the ignition key, maybe pull the fuel pump fuse and start the engine and let it run out of fuel first.

All that said, I'm wondering like others if it's vec/tuning related. RTTTT'd mention the gen of the car...that setting must be correct.

Plum is concerned about your cylinder walls. To much fuel washes the oil off the cylinder walls and isn't good on the rings....don't ask how I know just say a cuss word for the AEM injector controller

What you need to do IMO before going any farther is get set-up to read/write to your Vec so that some of us can look over your tunes/settings. You can e-mail the files.

 

[29OUTLAW]

Please guys and gals 34 veiws and no suggestions, thoughts, or comments. If I cant get this figured out by the end of this weekend I just might start the teardown and begin to go back to N/A, and I really dont want to do that.

Sorry for being anal, but next time be more descriptive in the title of your thread and you'll probably avoid a lot of unproductive thread views.

 

[ViperGeorge]

I don't have a VEC so I'm not familiar with its capabilities, but it certainly seems to be running waaaaaaaay rich. Not sure why one plug is clean but otherwise soaked in gas. Sounds like a misfire (or more correctly a no fire) on that cylinder. I don't believe idle air controllers are expensive, given the code you through why not swap it out to see if there is any difference. Maybe another nearby club member would allow you to use theirs for a test.

 

[ViperGTS]

Most problems start when people start to mod the Viper ...
And, most people cant handle the power a stock Viper has ...
So what? You are asking for trouble, if you mod the car.
Learn to handle the power of a stock Viper first and you will have so much FUN that there is NO need for more power. Exhaust/intake air mods are ok.
HAVE FUN and drive the car!

 

[ViperGeorge]

Most problems start when people start to mod the Viper ...
And, most people cant handle the power a stock Viper has ...
So what? You are asking for trouble, if you mod the car.
Learn to handle the power of a stock Viper first and you will have so much FUN that there is NO need for more power. Exhaust/intake air mods are ok.
HAVE FUN and drive the car!

Funny thing but in a recent Autoweek they cited a survey that showed that Viper owners were the most likely to say they wanted more power in their car. Clearly 500 or even 600 HP is not enough. I personally believe you can't have too much. None the less things break when you mod the engine and you need to be prepared to spend money to set it up properly and to fix it when it breaks (which it will).

 

[dave6666]

Hey... Right on Brother!

Most problems start when people start to mod the Viper ...
And, most people cant handle the power a stock Viper has ...
So what? You are asking for trouble, if you mod the car.
Learn to handle the power of a stock Viper first and you will have so much FUN that there is NO need for more power. Exhaust/intake air mods are ok.
HAVE FUN and drive the car!

Funny thing but in a recent Autoweek they cited a survey that showed that Viper owners were the most likely to say they wanted more power in their car. Clearly 500 or even 600 HP is not enough. I personally believe you can't have too much. None the less things break when you mod the engine and you need to be prepared to spend money to set it up properly and to fix it when it breaks (which it will).

 

[DVSGTS]

What you need to do IMO before going any farther is get set-up to read/write to your Vec so that some of us can look over your tunes/settings. You can e-mail the files.

I couldn't get my new laptop with Vista to work no way no how. I ended up picking up a cheap IBM thinkpad off of ebay for less than a $100 shipped and I was in business. The next thing and I'm serious, is you MUST be able to check your LTFTs. Get some sort of scan tool that will display them real time.

My car did the same things until I got a scan tool and scaled my injectors back so that at idle the LTFTs were as close to 0% as possible. Until I did that, during setup in the garagae, I burned through gas way too fast, my plugs were black and sooty some even wet and it was hard as hell getting it to stay running.

 

[Nates GTS Viper]

Thanks to all that have helped me. I just pm'd RTTTTed with my fuel info from my tune. I found an old computer and got the todos to work with it so now I can maybe see if that is the problem.

Now as far as the comments go about learning how to handle the power of the Viper and only doing exhaust mods please keep that crap to yourself. I mean to each his own but you dont know me my driving skill or what I like to do with the car. I also dont have any shops around that work on Vipers so I decided to tackle this on my own so that I could take pride in the finished result. I may have hit a couple humps in the road but thats just part of it sometimes. I have a 05 Ram srt-10 with a paxton and it has been every bit as reliable as any honda or toyota with the exeption of butning 20 times the amount of gas during its 60,000 miles with the supercharher on it. Also please keep your cars in the garages not driving them and do the exhaust upgrades, that way when mine does finally get drove to death I know theres a perfect one out there just waiting for me.

Again thanks to everyone for all the help with this and for all the info. Im working on every suggestion you all have mentioned. Also I removed the air intake valve and tried to clean it but it is still throwing the code after numerous times of deleting it. I think its stuck bc while watching it I never saw it move.

 

[ViperGTS]

crap

I have spent +65000 miles in my close to stock Vipers on the road, tracks and passes ...no crap. JUST FUN.

And anybody telling me that 450, 500 or 600 hp is not enough in a street car has a BIG EGO. Too big for me and my little brain!

 

[Nates GTS Viper]

Like I said wharever floats your boat. 450 hp was good but just wasnt enouph for what I wanted out of my car.

 

[ViperGeorge]

Re: crap

I have spent +65000 miles in my close to stock Vipers on the road, tracks and passes ...no crap. JUST FUN.

And anybody telling me that 450, 500 or 600 hp is not enough in a street car has a BIG EGO. Too big for me and my little brain!

Some of us actually track our cars. On the street maybe stock Viper power is enough but just because some of us want more power (for the track or for any other reason) doesn't mean we have big egos. And why do you care if we want to mod the heck out of the car, its our money and its our car. I refer you back to the recent Autoweek article that stated that Viper owners are the most likely to want more power. Why do you think Paxton, Roe, and so many other firms sell performance enhancing products for our cars?

 

[Nates GTS Viper]

Thank you gbatejan and well said.

 

[dave6666]

Thank you gbatejan and well said.

It is obviously a personal choice - mod the engine or not - but those like myself that choose not to partly because of the increased risk of headaches that can come with it, get to do a little ribbing toward those that are having tuning issues.

Kicking you when you're down. Sweet, huh?

 

[Red Snake]

Re: crap

I have spent +65000 miles in my close to stock Vipers on the road, tracks and passes ...no crap. JUST FUN.

And anybody telling me that 450, 500 or 600 hp is not enough in a street car has a BIG EGO. Too big for me and my little brain!

I guess my EGO is out of check too then, lol. My 660/710 from my Roe is not enough for me either.



Some people can handle the extra power and some can't. Don't give up Nate. Keep working at it.

 

[Kmrumedy]

Enjoying this thread Nate as it has great info though I am sorry as I can feel your frustration. What is the lastest update and what are you doing next to find the issue?

 

[Nates GTS Viper]

The latest update is that I am now able to look at my tune using a computer I found. I sent a pm to rtttted with the fuel info to see what he thinks. Other than that Im going to order a new air intake valve and a new set of the recomended plugs (to go in after I get this problem sorted out). Also I used a screwdiver to try to listen to the injectors. I could hear most of them pretty good but the drivers side rear I didnt hear any clicking. Could this be bc of the tune or could it be stuck wide open just dumping fuel? Also if it was stuck and I unhooked the inector plug would it still be open or would that stop all fuel from coming out of that inector?