2 Viper Fatalities in MA

[C-Note]

Clearly a case of someone whether they were a good driver or not being irresponsible in bad conditions. So they were not wearing seatbelts and conditions may not have been great. It is tragic and those people have now paid the ultimate price.

Those of you that are bad mouthing the poor people that have died from what could have been recklessness or maybe the simplest of mistakes should be ashamed of yourselves. It could have been as simple as a mis-shift, who knows?

I would be the first to admit that I have done some really stupid things in my cars including my Viper; I have been lucky enough to learn some important lessons just by having some serious close calls.

Anyone that has a Viper and tells you that they have never had a close call or done something irresponsible is lying and should trade it in on a Volvo.

The fact is that the Dodge Viper is a dangerous vehicle and sadly these things will continue to happen. Now the 2008 has 600 horse power and no “nanny” aids, this will equate to a whole lot more unqualified drivers with far more car than they can handle.

Every Viper should come with a discount coupon for a coffin; why else would it be on the very top of the list of most expensive cars to insure.

Please don’t get me wrong, I love my Viper. I am just getting sick of seeing these terrible accidents.

 

[bluestreak]

I agree.


TC FTW

 

[ViperDude]

I've driven just about every high end car short of an Enzo, and I can honestly say that the Viper is one of the most dangerous vehicles being sold to the public. Massive speed and acceleration coupled with occasional unpredictable traction issues are a recipe for disaster.

It is therefore unfathomable that any person, with any kind of brain cells, would get into a Viper and not put a seat belt on.

 

[Vipermann]

Those of you that are bad mouthing the poor people that have died from what could have been recklessness or maybe the simplest of mistakes should be ashamed of yourselves. It could have been as simple as a mis-shift, who knows?

I would be the first to admit that I have done some really stupid things in my cars including my Viper; I have been lucky enough to learn some important lessons just by having some serious close calls.

Anyone that has a Viper and tells you that they have never had a close call or done something irresponsible is lying and should trade it in on a Volvo.

The fact is that the Dodge Viper is a dangerous vehicle and sadly these things will continue to happen. Now the 2008 has 600 horse power and no “nanny” aids, this will equate to a whole lot more unqualified drivers with far more car than they can handle.

Every Viper should come with a discount coupon for a coffin; why else would it be on the very top of the list of most expensive cars to insure.

No. Nope. Don't agree.

For comparison -- far more dangerous vehicles are: ATVs, Jet skis and ALL motorcycles.

Motorcyles are a big contributor to keeping hospital ERs busy -- so let's ban 'em. ATV's are even worse -- those gotta go too. Each or these is more dangerous than any Viper.

So do you want to ban consumer access to those vehicles? The issue is people expecting the Viper to provide all of the safety because it's a 'car' -- but true performance cars never make such a promise ... safety comes from respect, some level of driving skill (beyond beginner) and defensive driving on the street with good judgement. Ralph Nader would not be welcome here.

 

[Warfang]

Clearly a case of someone whether they were a good driver or not being irresponsible in bad conditions. So they were not wearing seatbelts and conditions may not have been great. It is tragic and those people have now paid the ultimate price.

Those of you that are bad mouthing the poor people that have died from what could have been recklessness or maybe the simplest of mistakes should be ashamed of yourselves. It could have been as simple as a mis-shift, who knows?

I would be the first to admit that I have done some really stupid things in my cars including my Viper; I have been lucky enough to learn some important lessons just by having some serious close calls.

Anyone that has a Viper and tells you that they have never had a close call or done something irresponsible is lying and should trade it in on a Volvo.

The fact is that the Dodge Viper is a dangerous vehicle and sadly these things will continue to happen. Now the 2008 has 600 horse power and no “nanny” aids, this will equate to a whole lot more unqualified drivers with far more car than they can handle.

Every Viper should come with a discount coupon for a coffin; why else would it be on the very top of the list of most expensive cars to insure.

Please don’t get me wrong, I love my Viper. I am just getting sick of seeing these terrible accidents.

Dude... sell your viper and get an armored-up HMMWV... safest vehicle west of Bahgdad.

The problem isn't the car... it's no more dangerous than a steak knife. If you're dumb enough to throw it in the air high to see if you can catch it, I have no problem calling you an idiot if it lands point first on your noggin. If you believe your own holier than thou diatribe, then you should classify yourself mentally unfit and suicidal... I mean, driving a Viper for you means certain death right? Discounted coffins and all... especially since you've admitted being prone to doing stupid things in it.

I seem to recall quite a few enzos and carerra GTs wrecking... what dangerous cars!

 

[Warfang]

No. Nope. Don't agree.

For comparison -- far more dangerous vehicles are: ATVs, Jet skis and ALL motorcycles.

Motorcyles are a big contributor to keeping hospital ERs busy -- so let's ban 'em. ATV's are even worse -- those gotta go too. Each or these is more dangerous than any Viper.

So do you want to ban consumer access to those vehicles? The issue is people expecting the Viper to provide all of the safety because it's a 'car' -- but true performance cars never make such a promise ... safety comes from respect, some level of driving skill (beyond beginner) and defensive driving on the street with good judgement. Ralph Nader would not be welcome here.

All great points.

 

[Warfang]

I've driven just about every high end car short of an Enzo, and I can honestly say that the Viper is one of the most dangerous vehicles being sold to the public. Massive speed and acceleration coupled with occasional unpredictable traction issues are a recipe for disaster.

It is therefore unfathomable that any person, with any kind of brain cells, would get into a Viper and not put a seat belt on.

I have to disagree on unpredictable. I have never had the Viper slide out on me without me expecting it to... and I'm no seasoned racer... just a careful driver that know the limitations of my car. The fat tires give you loads of traction... the problem is if you pass the tolerances of physics, no nannytech in the world is going to save you. This applies to ALL cars, Enzos and Veyrons included.

All this fearmongering is just Viper stereotypes being perpetuated. I've seen vipers wiping out from excessive lift from high speed and bad road conditions resulting in flipping end over end with the passengers only suffering superficial injuries. I don't think you'll find a SAFER car than a Viper. An idiot can kill himself with a thumbtack.

 

[WOT!]

It is very sad to loose two people, most likely related. I hope everyone in New England and other cold climates remembers that cold temps and Vipers don't mix well. Also, thing usually happen in threes. BE CAREFUL!

The car is a black 2003 srt. I was provided with the name of the drive the other day and confirmed that he was not a member of the NE region. Just the same, my prayers go out to the family.

 

[mike & juli]

It is very sad to loose two people, most likely related. I hope everyone in New England and other cold climates remembers that cold temps and Vipers don't mix well. Also, thing usually happen in threes. BE CAREFUL!
The car is a black 2003 srt. I was provided with the name of the drive the other day and confirmed that he was not a member of the NE region. Just the same, my prayers go out to the family.

Thank you for more details, Joe...it's still a tragedy...and we DO have to remember, it IS a DRIVER'S car...the DRIVER is ultimately responsible for driving safely. Seatbelts ARE the law...for better or worse, whether you like them or not. NOT blaming this driver, my gosh, noooooo....just saying we ALL have to be careful, as I think we are all saying here.
ANYthing CAN and WILL happen...gotta drive defensively as best we can~~condolences to the families of the two tragically deceased. ~juli

 

[Vipuronr]

Can't blame the Viper, if they chose to not wear their seatbelts. It has been proven over and over that seatbelts save lives....and I know, we see this all the time!

Seatbelts or not, its a shame when anyone dies.

Peter
______________________

1998 RT/10, Red (5k Miles)

FIREFIGHTERS SAVE LIVES AND PROPERTY

SUPPORT TATORS DODGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

Everytime a Viper is wrecked the nanny tech crap comes up.

Exotic Cars, Wrecked Exotic Car Crashes, Car Crash Pictures - WreckedExotics.com

How many of those wrecked nanny cars have ABS, TC, etc.? Not only did it not help but it was most likely the cause of more accidents.

People get in them and think they can do anything they want and the car will save them. Jeeze people wake up. Learn how to drive and drive with respect.

That said, RIP to the deceased.

 

[PhoenixGTS]

Oh gawd. The victims are Todd and Michelle Marsh - parents of three children. This article says they were racing another car per a witness:

Worcester Telegram & Gazette News

Here is the article:

Witness details crash

Princeton couple are I-190 victims

By Scott J. Croteau TELEGRAM & GAZETTE STAFF
[email protected]

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Massachusetts State Police investigate the scene of a double fatal accident on I-190 North in West Boylston. (T&G Staff/STEVE LANAVA)

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Enlarge photo



WEST BOYLSTON— Mary K. Hakkinen had just spent the day selling flowers on the roadside with her son and was driving on Interstate 190 north on her way back to Orange.

Her speedometer was set at 60 miles per hour as she watched cars pass. Then Ms. Hakkinen, 51, noticed two cars rapidly approaching in the left lane.

Within moments, sparks flew as she watched one of the cars hit the concrete barrier on the left. Another car, a 2003 Dodge Viper, followed behind and also began skidding along the barrier.

Debris from the luxury sports car flew at her car, sparks spraying.

“I was engulfed in sparks at one moment,” she said.

The Viper then cut in front of her and struck the guardrail on the right side of the road where it became wedged.

Ms. Hakkinen stopped her car, jumped out and ran to the crashed vehicle. The Viper was smoking; music from the sound system was blaring.

“Can anyone hear me,” she yelled into the car which had its roof shaved off. She knew there was a man inside, but no response came back.

“I just had the most wonderful Mother’s Day. I was thinking this was a perfect day,” she said sobbing during a telephone interview. “All I could think of was it was somebody’s son. I couldn’t believe what was happening.”

The two people in the car, a man and woman whom state police have not identified, died in the Sunday night crash on I-190, near Exit 5.

The Telegram & Gazette has learned, however, that the crash victims were Michelle and Todd Marsh of Princeton. They have three children and recently opened Curious Kids Early Childcare Development in Hudson.

A woman who answered the phone there yesterday declined to comment.

A family member contacted through e-mail yesterday said Mrs. Marsh’s father died last year, and the family is in shock because of the latest tragedy.

The accident, which occurred around 9:45 p.m., remains under investigation by state police.

A preliminary investigation by Trooper Hari Arisetty indicates that Mr. Marsh, a developer, was driving the Viper north on I-190, about one mile before Exit 5, when he lost control, struck the concrete barrier on the left side of the road and veered across the travel lanes, striking the guardrail on the right side of the road.

State police said they had no other information about a second car.

The husband and wife were not wearing seatbelts and suffered fatal injuries in the crash, state police said.

“Although speed appears to have been a factor, this crash remains under investigation, with the assistance of the State Police Collision Analysis and Reconstruction Section and the State Police Crime Scene Services Section,” a state police news release stated.

The West Boylston fire and police departments responded to the scene and the right lane of I-190 north was closed for about four hours.

Witnesses the night of the crash said the couple’s car was going faster than 75 miles per hour.

A Pepperell man who was driving with his family saw the Dodge Viper and a smaller, silver car pass him. The man said he was driving with his family — about 70 to 75 miles per hour — when he saw the two cars pass him quickly.

“They blew by me like I was standing still,” he said, declining to be identified. .

He lost sight of the Viper, then noticed cars ahead of him were coming to a stop. He saw the crash and his wife called police. .

Police questioned witnesses, said Mrs. Hakkinen, who noted that authorities on the scene checked to ensure she was all right to drive after witnessing the crash.

“It all happened so fast,” she said. “If I hadn’t slowed down, he probably would have hit me in my driver’s side. I’m very sorry two people ended up dead.”

Scott J. Croteau can be reached by e-mail at [email protected].

 

[jmillsUT28]

What sad news...

 

[musicncars]

there goes the theory that an animal jumped in front of them and they tried to avoid it.

 

[C-Note]

Wow looks like I have pissed a few people off. That wasn’t my intension.

Vipermann,

I didn’t say that I wanted to ban anything!!

You are right; ATVs and motor cycles are dangerous as well, maybe more dangerous?
Here is the difference, I had get a special endorsement to ride my motorcycle and most all of the training for it was about safety.
When I bought my ATV the dealer included a safety video and offered for free a safety training class.

It would just be nice to see a little more education, I got my education from driving my car and like I said I had a few close calls.


Warfang,

You are right the car is not the biggest part of the problem; it is the people that are driving them.

Like I said before I have had some close calls in mine, most of it was from being inexperienced. I have had other fast cars but none of the muscle cars I had in the past required the skill level to drive that my Viper does, not even close.

Yes super cars are dangerous, all of them not just the Viper; no I don’t feel like driving mine is a death sentence but the first few mistakes I made could have cost me dearly if I had not been a little lucky.

I don’t know if any of the rumors are true about the super high chance of wrecking your Viper in the first three months of ownership being just as high as that of a crotch rocket, but I would tend to believe it.


Just my .02….

 

[C-Note]

And with the latest new it looks like they were just being stupid, its a shame...

 

[PDCjonny]

A Pepperell man who was driving with his family saw the Dodge Viper and a smaller, silver car pass him. The man said he was driving with his family — about 70 to 75 miles per hour — when he saw the two cars pass him quickly.

“They blew by me like I was standing still,” he said, declining to be identified.

Geez... and no seat belts. A whole bunch of bad decisions that night.
Condolences to the families.

 

[Bobpantax]

Horrible. Three children left without parents. What were they thinking?! Let me answer my own question. They weren't thinking.

 

[Venomiss]

3 kids that don't get to have Mom tuck them in at night, or hug them when they're sick.
3 kids that don't get to have Dad play catch, or tell them bedtime stories.
3 kids that won't have a Mom or Dad attend their soccer games or come to parents night at the school.
3 kids that won't have a Mom or Dad to take pictures at graduation.
3 kids that will be lucky to stay together with whatever family member that decides they can take them in.

If you can't have any respect for the dead then at least have some respect for the living.

 

[GRNBGON]

From looking at the picture, I don't think wearing or not wear seat belts was what caused their death. It looks like the guard rail cut off a major part of their anatomy. Please correct me if I am wrong.
Condolences to the family.

 

[Shandon]

The investigation will show one thing.... The driver was distracted by the intolerable ding ding ding ding noise that NEVER goes away when you don't where youre seat belt. I have moved my viper from one garage to another and that dinging drives me up a wall. I could never drive my car without a seatbelt and that dinging is reason enough for me!

My prayers to the children and loved ones affected by this tragedy

 

[Got Venom]

I never even thought about this, since I "ALWAYS" wear my seat belt, but does that dinging sound keep going forever, if you are driving without a belt on, and why would anyone or "two people" put up with that racket, unless, like the witness said the music was still blaring, and maybe they did not even hear the dinging? I feel bad now, because my wife and I came home from a Viper event this last Friday, and when there was a shot of open freeway, I punched it up to 130, and passed a couple of cars, and my wife told me to knock it off. So I did, but I only did it for a second, and did not think I was being crazy, but maybe this guy did the same thing? Damn sometimes you think you are invincible?

 

[97GTS]

Imagine if the family of this couple were to come here and read your comments. You couldn't reflect any more poorly on this club if you tried. While I agree that some bad decisions were made (and I think you have the agreement of most folks here on that point), you will save this kind of rhetoric for some place besides Viperclub.org. Don't post in this thread again or you WILL be taking a vacation.

THE STAFF

THANK YOU!! I honestly don't know what people get by making these kind of statements. It makes me wonder just how miserable this poor guy is that he has to make Darwin statements about fellow Viper owners. It DOES reflect poorly on the VCA when people make statements like this. He should be sent on a vacation for lack of judgement.

Ron

 

[PhoenixGTS]

THANK YOU!! I honestly don't know what people get by making these kind of statements.

He's just swinging his intrawebz caulk Ron. Call him out then let it go. He would never have said in the presence of the family is my guess.

 

[belair1957]

From looking at the picture, I don't think wearing or not wear seat belts was what caused their death. ... Please correct me if I am wrong.
Condolences to the family.

Not wearing the belt could have precluded regaining control of the vehicle or even contributed to the loss of control.

IMO Most people can recover from one mistake, two mistakes possibly, three mistakes almost never. Mistake no. 1 - Not wearing a belt. Mistake number two - street racing (if true) on what was apparently a busy highway. Mistake number three, who knows...

 

[pcc]

Comment Removed By Staff

 

[DreamOn]

Imagine if the family of this couple were to come here and read your comments. You couldn't reflect any more poorly on this club if you tried. While I agree that some bad decisions were made (and I think you have the agreement of most folks here on that point), you will save this kind of rhetoric for some place besides Viperclub.org. Don't post in this thread again or you WILL be taking a vacation.

THE STAFF

When I read your reply, I wanted to stand up and cheer! You are a great service to this forum and I am proud of you for saying what many of us probably thought when we read his/her remark.

 

[Warfang]

Yes, the remark was rather harsh, and can be taken in several ways... none of which would have been helpful to the situation. The guy said something stupid and received the proper reprimand. Let's just drop it, or better yet, maybe the mods can just delete the post and all the references to it.

 

[Chopper]

It's hard for some people to show some (any) class.I think that the best and only thing to come for something so horrible, is that we all can find an awareness within ourselves to maybe prevent another accident such as the one that took place Sunday nite.

 

[2006red/whitecoupe]

The seat belt dinging can be turned off just by following the instructions in the owners manual; this feature would be used by those with 5 or 6 point belts installed and not using the seat belt at a track day. My condolances to the family; we will never know but perhaps if the driver had spent time at a Viper Day event or a track day maybe there would have been a different outcome.