Is a viper with navigation really a viper???

[Zan186]

Buy a Vette. I have no problem with people like you buying a Vette. Please buy a Vette. It has all that crap that makes driving fun for you.

The Viper has (had) bare essentials that made driving fun for me. Don't go changing my car when every other car on the market fits your wants and needs.

Does your car have Air conditioning? Wind shield Wipers? Glass Windows? Stereo?

See their is a slight problem with your concept of a car Chuck. You seem to want certain things but then draw the line with others. Sounds to me like you just want a race car.

Most people who buy Vipers are buying the car because of the way it looks and second because it has huge amounts of power. The amenities are kind of over looked after air conditioning, power windows, and a stereo.

Personally, Dodge needs to make options available. Traction Control, ABS, Navigation, Cruise Control should all be options for the Viper. If you want it you order it, if you don't want it you don't order it. I would even go so far as to request that Dodge offer 3 different models of Vipers based on performance.
1) You Basic GTS/RT10/SRT which is pretty much what we have now
2) A Roe or Paxton Supercharged Viper with a 3 year warranty
3) A Twin Turbo Viper with a 1 year warranty.

Halo cars (and that is what a Viper is), need to have huge performance numbers. Giving the consumer options is always a good thing.
This whole concept of keeping the car in the age of basic's is absurd. As Viper owner's we seem to gravitate to slandering new technology because the Vipers biggest opponent the Z06 has all the toys. Hence we make fun of "the Nanny Control". I would definatley want TC if it was an option. I am a good driver but safety is a big factor. Vipers are safe cars as long as you dont push the limits. When you get on it the car can become quite an unstable beast. Anyone, who thinks they are an expert driver are delussional. There are guys who race in Nascar that still lose control and smash their cars. It comes down a lot to fate or luck! You hit oil or antifreeze and you are pushing the car you are in for some trouble.

Just look at it this way, you have AC, glass windows and a stereo you are no longer a purist. Drop the AC, add plexiglass race windows and no stereo and gut the interior and you will be a purist.

 

[bluestreak]

and your probly the worst driver in the world but the viper is so amazing you want to be able to drive it because you probly cant handle a car made without TC. If you really track a car like you said youve been to road atlanta you would already know that without tration control makes a car go quicker lap times (if your a good driver) and is funner. A viper is a big boy car if you cant handle it buy a z06

LOL another bench racer. I'll be happy to prove you wrong concerning my driving skills at any time.

Why should I get a Z06, so I can come and embarass all the VIpers at viper days as the recent video showed???

You still havent gotten the fact that I am not reffering to myself when I talk about a need for TC. My only point is that the car is no less of a viper with it, especially when it can be turned off, but some of you are too hardheaded to get that concept.


I'll give you a few scenarios where TC can be helpful in a viper and then you tell me that you wouldnt have needed it in that situation.

- You are driving home from the track (assuming some of you that are bickering actually go), it starts raining heavily, standing water everywhere, if you had TC would it be on or off?

- You're at the track (once again assuming) first time driving in the rain on slicks or on slicks period and you know that you get little notice before they let go, TC on or off for the first few laps to get used to the tires?


I'm not the best driver, but certainly not the worst, but I know there are some times where I'd rather leave the TC on.


And it's obvious that most of you dont know a thing about tracking, because if you did you would know that you can still go almost as fast with TC on. A skilled driver can keep TC from coming on, but none of you would know about that. My fastest lap at RA with TC is only 1 sec slower than my fastest without it, and I doubt any of you talking here could beat that time.

 

[Warfang]

Does your car have Air conditioning? Wind shield Wipers? Glass Windows? Stereo?

Must we use this failing argument AGAIN? The Viper is designed to be the most basic car FOR ITS TIME. It'll never be completely devoid of technology, but no other car can point to it and claim to be more of a driver's car. It's creation was hinged on that fact. Get over it. So over time, it will evolve and have more technology, but it should NEVER be to "catch up" to anyone. The Viper apologizes to NO ONE for it's lack of creature comforts or nannytech.

Understand WHY the Viper was created and you won't seem such the schmuck around here. Fortunately, it doesnt matter what you pansies have to say. The people behind the Viper understand what's it's about.

Let's quote Herb AGAIN, shall we?

Herb Helbig, is the “Grailkeeper“. His official title is Manager of Vehicle Synthesis. In other words, he is keeping the Viper, as it EVOLVES (MY emphasis) through the course of its life, true to the original set of parameters.

From Herb himself:

We’ve got to keep it simple, we’ve got to make it fun, its got to be the most outrageous car you’ve ever touched. When you turn the key on, the hair on the back of your neck has got to stand up. It’s got to be a visceral, emotional, almost religious experience. It falls to me to make sure that we don’t lose sight of why we started this program. It’s all about fun, passion, and the desire just to put people back on their heels to say “I can’t believe these guys made such an outrageous, awesome, off-the-scale car”. It’s a challenge to mature it, to grow the car up a little, yet not lose its essence. When people come to me and say “you know it really needs cruise control; I took one to Chicago and my right foot got kinda tired…” that guy gets thrown out of my office. Or a guy comes in and says “you know, it would be cool if we had power seats’ that guy gets thrown out of the building. And the guy who says “I think we need an automatic transmission” well, they’re still looking for his body.

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

Just look at it this way, you have AC, glass windows and a stereo you are no longer a purist. Drop the AC, add plexiglass race windows and no stereo and gut the interior and you will be a purist.

Perhaps you missed the part where I wrote my AC hasn't worked in two years and my stereo (that's that thing below the gauges right?) hasn't worked in more than two years. But that's my street Viper, my track Viper has never had AC or a stereo.

As for the plexiglass, you'll have to talk to the government for that.

Interior? LOL I think I made my point.

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

Why should I get a Z06, so I can come and embarass all the VIpers at viper days as the recent video showed???

"All the Vipers?" LOL Uh-huh.

The reason you need a Z06 is because you need a car that is easy to drive. It's ok. We don't mind. Enjoy it. But why you are so adamant on changing our car is beyond me. Do you have stock in some TC product company? If so, I hope it doesn't fail like the TC on the SCCA World Challenge Cadillac earlier this year or like the ABS failures that happen occasionally at the track.

Oh wait, I forgot. You can't drive a car without TC. Well at least you have dozens of TC cars to choose from.

 

[Warfang]

This is the problem with the world today. No one wants to EARN the prize that goes with the skills. They'd rather dumb down the subject matter so they can claim that the results are the same. Well... it's not.

 

[JKVIPER]

Yes, it is really a viper.

 

[bluestreak]

"All the Vipers?" LOL Uh-huh.

The reason you need a Z06 is because you need a car that is easy to drive. It's ok. We don't mind. Enjoy it. But why you are so adamant on changing our car is beyond me. Do you have stock in some TC product company? If so, I hope it doesn't fail like the TC on the SCCA World Challenge Cadillac earlier this year or like the ABS failures that happen occasionally at the track.

Oh wait, I forgot. You can't drive a car without TC. Well at least you have dozens of TC cars to choose from.

LOL no car is easy to drive when if you're going fast enough. I dont know why you people are getting so defensive, you are fighting a losing battle, you might as well accept it. You're comprehension isnt very far along either, I simply said it wouldnt be less of a viper with TC that can be disabled and you cant get over it. I'm not trying to change anything, it's not up to me to do, just like it's not up to you either.

Face it, the people that think like you are few and far between, that's why you are so insecure, the large majority of people who can and have purchased vipers wont mind TC, just like they dont mind Nav.

HAHA I bet I could beat you at a neutral track (one neither has driven before) with my TC on, bring your stongage thinking and put your mouth to the test. And FYI my car is a nearly full weight, slightly modified street car (not my corvette)

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

HAHA I bet I could beat you at a neutral track (one neither has driven before) with my TC on, bring your stongage thinking and put your mouth to the test. And FYI my car is a nearly full weight, slightly modified street car (not my corvette)

I see now. We're arguing with a 17-year-old.

Most of us will be leaving now. Enjoy your nannies.

 

[SNKEBIT]

out...............

 

[Warfang]

LOL no car is easy to drive when if you're going fast enough. I dont know why you people are getting so defensive, you are fighting a losing battle, you might as well accept it. You're comprehension isnt very far along either, I simply said it wouldnt be less of a viper with TC that can be disabled and you cant get over it. I'm not trying to change anything, it's not up to me to do, just like it's not up to you either.

Face it, the people that think like you are few and far between, that's why you are so insecure, the large majority of people who can and have purchased vipers wont mind TC, just like they dont mind Nav.

HAHA I bet I could beat you at a neutral track (one neither has driven before) with my TC on, bring your stongage thinking and put your mouth to the test. And FYI my car is a nearly full weight, slightly modified street car (not my corvette)

Yeah... when all else fails, flex what little muscle you have.

Big mouth... little brains.

Anyways, back to your regularly scheduled programming...

 

[bluestreak]

Yeah... when all else fails, flex what little muscle you have.

Big mouth... little brains.

Anyways, back to your regularly scheduled programming...

I'm flexing? You two have repeatedly told me I **** at driving, I have no problem proving you wrong. Notice we are on the viper forum and you still dont have much backup, this should tell you something. There are 2 1/2 of you arguing here, yet plenty of people have some here and said they wouldnt mind TC, and many would be interested in paddle shifters. You are a getting bent out of shape over something thats not all that big of a deal.

 

[Warfang]

I'm flexing? You two have repeatedly told me I **** at driving, I have no problem proving you wrong. Notice we are on the viper forum and you still dont have much backup, this should tell you something. There are 2 1/2 of you arguing here, yet plenty of people have some here and said they wouldnt mind TC, and many would be interested in paddle shifters. You are a getting bent out of shape over something thats not all that big of a deal.

For the record, I have never said YOU specifically sucked at driving. I wouldn't know either way. For all I know, you're Danica Patrick. Nah... SHE ***** at driving.

Now go cry home to mama.

 

[trumper Z06]

Hhmmmm.... very entertaining thread !!!

Great reading remarks about the Viper from those who drive the Beast.

 

[kllymartin]

Thread is as *** as the "What are you buying your corvette for xmas" thread on CF. Whether it looks better or enhances the driving experience...it's an improvement either way. By this logic...A/C, ABS, power windows, power locks and god-forbid a convertable top, make it less of a Viper.

It does look better and for those of us that actually venture out of town in them, nav is a huge plus.

You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[AFL in NJ]

Holy cow Batman!!! Is that a nitrous bottle warmer behind the shifter or what?

I like the Viper because it represents the closest thing to the original Shelby Cobra idea in today's world. I hate sweating when I drive, so I need air conditioning, not heated or cooled seats, just a plain old air conditioner. I don't want NAV unless of course I can override it to play videos of my favorite songs as I drive....or scroll the pics in a fancy slideshow from the Viper/chicks thread. If I get lost....well then I'm going to have to find my way out and I'll likely meet some people who dream of Vipers who will help me get back onto whatever road I was trying to get to. I don't want lighted makeup mirrors on the sun shades, I don't want massaging seats, nor do I want the Viper to get "soft" like many sports cars have migrated to nowadays.

I don't want cup holders as I don't believe the Viper is a car that you shouldn't be driving and doing something else at the same time..... uhhh let me revise that....eating and driving shouldn't happen in a Viper.....uhhhh okay, my passenger can eat (omitted for content rule requirements), but I'll remain concentrating on my driving.

I'd rather not have traction and stability control on a Viper either, I think it strays too much from the Cobra theme. I'm sure at some point some bean-counter will make Dodge add those systems to the Viper as an option and it would be an option I wouldn't buy. 99% of my time is on the street and very little of my time is spent anywhere near a stretch of private asphalt where I can really test my vehicle's limits.....however, I own a Viper for those rare chances when I get time to become a better driver, where some electronic system isn't correcting the basics of car control and making me appear to be a better driver than I am. If I can't learn my specific car at lower speeds and in small doses, then I'm an idiot to attempt some truly high speeds. I believe traction and stability control systems are meant for cars other than the Viper....just my own personal 2 cents.

I backed up my belief by buying a car (MB SL500 Sport) that has all those systems...and who drives that car primarily? Yep, my fiancee.

Regards,
Aaron

 

[bluestreak]

Thread is as *** as the "What are you buying your corvette for xmas" thread on CF. Whether it looks better or enhances the driving experience...it's an improvement either way. By this logic...A/C, ABS, power windows, power locks and god-forbid a convertable top, make it less of a Viper.

It does look better and for those of us that actually venture out of town in them, nav is a huge plus.

Sorry, your car is not a viper anymore because you added navigation, please remove all bagdges and decals immediately!

 

[sween]

Sorry, your car is not a viper anymore because you added navigation, please remove all bagdges and decals immediately!

you finally get it!! our work is done!

 

[bluestreak]

you finally get it!! our work is done!

sarcasm owns you!!!!

 

[kllymartin]

Sorry, your car is not a viper anymore because you added navigation, please remove all bagdges and decals immediately!

Ha. I did that to, and it looked even better.

 

[ViperTony]

This thread inspired me so I ordered a new vanity plate today:

You must be registered for see images

 

[JKVIPER]

Yes, it is really a viper.

Matter of fact. I installed a cruise control and Garmin Nav and the car is still a Viper. Still looks like a viper, sounds like a Viper, drives like a Viper. Yes, it is a viper.

Plus, after a month of using the Garmin and cruise control it did not turn into an Aston Martin nor Z06, still a Viper.

 

[bluestreak]

could've bought a set of PS2's, but really only needed rear tires, so I got two new rear runcraps. Two weeks ago, these rear runcraps, about 6 months old, with NO track usage whatsoever, gave way, skidded as I maneuvered to avoid instant death, and caused me to "lose it" into a bridge rail, totalling the car. If I had it to do again, no way would I have runcraps on my car. PS2's would've stuck as well or better than my Pilots on my longgone GTS. YOu're RIGHTm RMBSRT: runcraps ARE DANGEROUS!!!!!! [/qoute]

This is quoted from another thread, bet TC would have helped here. Also, putting runflats on a 500 hp car isnt being barebones, its cheap, and stupid. Just another situation that nearly every driver faces at some point or another, just hope your not in a viper when it happens. Non TC cars should be track only cars, where the "purists" can enjoy them.

 

[GR8_ASP]

Enough already. Do you have to state this on dozens of threads over and over???

You will get your way as it will be a governmental mandate in the near future. Until then buzz off and let the real owners (of Vipers not Corvettes) provide the appropriate market pressure.

 

[bluestreak]

Enough already. Do you have to state this on dozens of threads over and over???

You will get your way as it will be a governmental mandate in the near future. Until then buzz off and let the real owners (of Vipers not Corvettes) provide the appropriate market pressure.

Your math is pretty bad, this is the thread I have discussed it in, I briefly mentioned it in the paddle shifter thread, not exactly a dozen, quite the drama queen huh?

 

[Warfang]

Your math is pretty bad, this is the thread I have discussed it in, I briefly mentioned it in the paddle shifter thread, not exactly a dozen, quite the drama queen huh?

yawn

 

[GR8_ASP]

Your math is pretty bad, this is the thread I have discussed it in, I briefly mentioned it in the paddle shifter thread, not exactly a dozen, quite the drama queen huh?

And Bluestreak what exactly does a navigation unit or paddle shifters have to do with traction control. Nothing. That is correct. That is why we call it trolling. Just making noise. not on topic and not from a Viper owners perspective. Just noise.

 

[bluestreak]

And Bluestreak what exactly does a navigation unit or paddle shifters have to do with traction control. Nothing. That is correct. That is why we call it trolling. Just making noise. not on topic and not from a Viper owners perspective. Just noise.

Because they are creature comforts, something the purists are against. IF you dont know even that much, then it's you who is the troll.

 

[Got_Vnum]

Did the addition of proper power glass windows to the original R/T 10 make it less of a Viper? What about air conditioning? Or is a GTS less of a Viper since it has a proper roof, after all the original Viper was meant to be a roadster? What about the switch to the smoother idling cam? Or ABS? Or the Connelly leather? YES its still a Viper. The fact is most people enjoy their Vipers on the street and as such we have to deal with real world problems like getting stuck in traffic on a hot day, and getting lost and needing directions, or not being able to find a gas station. Not only is it still a Viper, its a BETTER Viper for your intended use. Thats why its an option, if you don't want it, don't order it.

 

[SylvanSRT]

i was hoping this thread was dead why was it brought back to life almost 3 months after last post