Next Gen Viper/New body style

[First Strike]

Well as we are all aware the 2008's are here and from what I have seen and read , this is one awsome snake. However I purchased a 06 coupe about 19 months ago and do not believe a new hood as on the 08's are reason enough to purchase a 2008. Now I already know there is gonna be several members that reply that the 08 is more than a hood change, (additional 100HP) ect which can be easly matched with a paxton. My question is when do you guys believe the next generation viper will be produced meaning all new body style. I truly believe it will be here sooner than most think...

 

[Wayne Finch]

2010 if ever

 

[ROCKET62]

As you predicted some would say - The '08 IS A LOT more than a hood change and just adding a paxton will not make your '06 comparable - except for engine power - with questionable reliability - as compared to the normally aspirated '08. The '08 is a Gen 4 with a completely new engine, new trans & clutch, new rear end, and upgraded brakes & tires for starters.

While the skin stayed the same, with the exception of the hood, the new color schemes also add to the Gen 4 difference. The one area that Dodge could have improved on was the rear end on the vert and a new nose to match the aggressive hood style - ala comp coupe. I would also like Dodge to fix the "jeep-like trail rated" gaps between the tires and the fenders.

I cant see a huge redesign happening with the Viper. The Gen 4 is nearly perfect and a few more tweaks here and there with help from the aftermarket supporters achieves perfection. It would be nice to lose a few pounds, but the Viper has an inherant disadvantage with the 2 extra cylinders - and I for one - believe the Viper should always be V10 based.

Are the differences enough for someone that just purchased an '06 to upgrade? Maybe not, but for some of the Gen 1/2 holdouts, for those that have to have a new car every couple of years, and for those that have never had the priviledge of owning a Viper - the new Gen 4 Viper is AWESOME!

 

[DMan]

I'm kinda with ya on perfection, the new hood is wicked & gray two tone interior is my choice, maybe better wheel options.

But, the only real change I'd like to see would be the coupe rear style on the vert. I got a vert cause I gotta go top down on cruisin, but it's a compromise to me cause I love the style of the coupe rearend much more. Hec I like looking at the coupe's rear almost as much as my wife's. ;-)

 

[Venomiss]

Well as we are all aware the 2008's are here and from what I have seen and read , this is one awsome snake. However I purchased a 06 coupe about 19 months ago and do not believe a new hood as on the 08's are reason enough to purchase a 2008. Now I already know there is gonna be several members that reply that the 08 is more than a hood change, (additional 100HP) ect which can be easly matched with a paxton. My question is when do you guys believe the next generation viper will be produced meaning all new body style. I truly believe it will be here sooner than most think...

You can upgrade your status to Viper Owner here by sending a PM to the moderators with your information. Nobody else will see it except them. Send it to kcobean or
Lee00blacksilverGTS and either one can help.
If you want to go the extra mile as a VCA member and get a cool avatar.
Or if you feel the need to purchase those raffle tickets for the new 2008 ACR that was on the cover of Autoweek then maybe you'll think about joining the Viper Club online.
All that information is in the new owners section at the top under renewals online.
We'd love to see you!

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

As you predicted some would say - The '08 IS A LOT more than a hood change ... upgraded brakes ...

Are you mixing in the ACR with this? Because the "base" Vipers certainly arent getting a brake system change/upgrade.

Jon

 

[Andrew/USPWR]

I'd like to see the Gen V have a new body style change that will WOW us like the GTS does. The SRT/10's are great looking but the Gen II look fantastic. IMO

Think FirePower looks.

 

[Vipermann]

My question is when do you guys believe the next generation viper will be produced meaning all new body style. I truly believe it will be here sooner than most think...

Answer: Probably never. Going forward, think in terms of 'evolution,' like the Porsche 911. The SRT guys have already explained that they were given a *** of capital, enough to redesign the body, or upgrade the power/performance, but not enough to do both. They chose the latter.

The new private equity owner is hurting BAD financially. Berry, berry, bad. In addition to Chrysler, they are also the recent new proud owners of 51% of GMAC, with all of it's sub-prime-slime. And they just backed out of the take-over bidding for Northern Rock. All of this = = No more 'wads of capital' for the Viper for a long time, if ever.

And then there's the whole -- 8.4L V-10 in a world with $100 oil -- issue.

So expect some new colors here and there, some interior tweaks ... and maybe a tweaked new nose and tail lights at some point, but you may be looking at the last Viper design -- hopefully to be sold for many more years, long enough for the company to regain its financial stability.

But as evolution goes from something as good as this '08 Viper, 'never' (for a redesign) may be a good thing. I sold my '05 to buy this instant-collectable '08.

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

The viper's days are not numbered. I agree we'll see more profound changes in the future. IF your buying the 08 thinking its the last of the bread, your going to be sadly mistaken.

Gen 5 will come, that doesnt deflate the gen 4, just like the gen 4 didnt deflate the gen 3. Its called evolution and its inevitable

Enjoy the gen 3.5's I'll wait for the full gen 5

Jon

 

[MoparMan]

Jon's right. There are already plans for a ZC platform for the Viper. I'll let you all theorize as to what those plans might entail.

 

[First Strike]

Actually I think it's time for me to try my luck at the ACR and become a VCA member. Thanks

 

[29OUTLAW]

Ever notice how when you see a C6 Vette coming you can't really tell whether it's a Z06 or a regular Vette until it passes right by you.

Even though I haven't seen any 08 Vipers yet, it'll be the same way. I won't know it's an 08 until I'm right next to it. For that reason, it's not a Gen-4 (sorry but that's just my criteria).

 

[dave6666]

In less than 2 years the '08 Viper body with be implanted to the C7.

I've never seen a Vette that looks like my GTS.

 

[Nine Ball]

I've never seen a Corvette period that looks like any Viper. Just because they share clear headlights, that doesn't make them the same to me. Park them side by side, you'd be ignorant if you thought they were the same. I've never seen a Viper on the road and accidentally thought it was a Corvette. The Viper (any year) has 100000x more identity on the road, even non-car people can identify them pretty well.

 

[Vipermann]

Jon's right. There are already plans for a ZC platform for the Viper. I'll let you all theorize as to what those plans might entail.

'Plans' don't mean squat. Ceberus is, just now, laying down new strategies towards getting a return from their investment. If you think there's better than a 60% chance those current next Gen Viper 'plans' will continue -- all the way to production -- well, that could be the sad mistake if you hold off and wait for that Gen5.

And that's just looking at the financial issues. Auto makers are, only now, getting serious about the changes needed to address $100 oil. Need a preview? Go back and look at one of those book store car books with all the cars from over the years ... take a look at how the cars changed from the early 70s, after the gas crisis (which permanently raised gas prices, similar to today) and check out some of those hot, high-performance '75 and '76 models ...

I truly, but sadly, believe that the only thing that will save the Viper is if Chrysler gets VERY serious with the car in racing -- on TV and in pictures on posters and magazines everywhere ... it was only the demand created from that established, unique, pure-racing image that saved Porsche back in the late 1970s (something that brand needs to get back to, by the way), while other sports cars faded.

I don't want to be negative, but I won't whistle in the dark either.

 

[DMan]

I agree that you have to be pretty car ignorant to not tell a viper from a C6, but ... I've had 4 vette guys approach me in a gas station with "nice vette", one said "how do you like your Z" as in Z06, umm, I even had the top down - I just said,"I love it" & laughed.

I think once you see an 08 in person it'll be pretty easy for a normal car guy/gal to tell it's an 08, the hood has a dramatic raise for the scoop and raised edges on the vents that are very noticeable, of course I do know at least 4 vette guys that may have trouble telling though. lol

 

[29OUTLAW]

If the Vette comments are in regard to my post, I just want to clear up that I wasn't suggesting an 08 Viper will be hard to distingush from a Vette. I was saying an 08 Viper will be hard to distuingush from an 03-06 Viper. They'll be a lot of rubber-necking to get a look at the hood.

 

[Kenneth Krieger]

Why isn't 7 and $8 gas an issue in Europe when it comes to exotic cars with massive hp? It's because there are still those who don't give a flip about how much gas costs.....they just put it in the tank and drive. There will always be a market for the Viper.....they only make 1,200 to 1,500 a year. $4 gas....does that really make a difference for you to take the car out for a jaunt on the weekends??

 

[rtigert]

Even though I haven't seen any 08 Vipers yet, it'll be the same way. I won't know it's an 08 until I'm right next to it. For that reason, it's not a Gen-4 (sorry but that's just my criteria).

You will if it's an ACR

 

[Andrew/USPWR]

If the Viper goes so does Chrysler Corp. IMO

 

[DylanGTS]

And that's just looking at the financial issues. Auto makers are, only now, getting serious about the changes needed to address $100 oil. Need a preview? Go back and look at one of those book store car books with all the cars from over the years ... take a look at how the cars changed from the early 70s, after the gas crisis (which permanently raised gas prices, similar to today) and check out some of those hot, high-performance '75 and '76 models ...

I could be incorrect, but I'm pretty sure that had to do with new emission standards not the price of oil. The technology to cut emissions produced by the muscle car was new in the mid 70's. This new technology then hindered the performance.

DylanGTS

 

[Vipermann]

I could be incorrect, but I'm pretty sure that had to do with new emission standards not the price of oil. The technology to cut emissions produced by the muscle car was new in the mid 70's. This new technology then hindered the performance.

DylanGTS

It was both factors. Emissions actually started to affect performance in the early 70s, as V8 power numbers started to come down from a peak just a few years earlier. But Jimmy Carter, elected in 1976, imposed the then 'new' 55 mph national speed limit and the EPA began to impose fuel economy standards ... and, in 1974, there were no more V8 Mustangs, and we were given the 'hot' Mustang II with it's V6. The V6 became the automaker's infatuation. Other cars with V8s saw sales slow or were discontinued too. My first car in HS was a used 1973 Mustang. It was about the only thing other than a Firebird or Camaro that could be found with a V8, and it was a weak V8 at that.

As for Europe, most of those exotics wouldn't be around if they weren't sold in the US -- they don't sell enough in Europe alone. If you've ever spent any time in Europe, the first thing you will notice is how small most of the cars are. And many are diesel. They are VERY aware of fuel prices. Fuel is expensive in Japan too -- not many V8 (or V10s) coming from there either.

 

[Andrew/USPWR]

If you think about it it was the outrageousness of the 400hp V10 Viper that snapped us out of those 70's Carter era.

 

[DylanGTS]

It was both factors. Emissions actually started to affect performance in the early 70s, as V8 power numbers started to come down from a peak just a few years earlier. But Jimmy Carter, elected in 1976, imposed the then 'new' 55 mph national speed limit and the EPA began to impose fuel economy standards ... and, in 1974, there were no more V8 Mustangs, and we were given the 'hot' Mustang II with it's V6. The V6 became the automaker's infatuation. Other cars with V8s saw sales slow or were discontinued too. My first car in HS was a used 1973 Mustang. It was about the only thing other than a Firebird or Camaro that could be found with a V8, and it was a weak V8 at that.

As for Europe, most of those exotics wouldn't be around if they weren't sold in the US -- they don't sell enough in Europe alone. If you've ever spent any time in Europe, the first thing you will notice is how small most of the cars are. And many are diesel. They are VERY aware of fuel prices. Fuel is expensive in Japan too -- not many V8 (or V10s) coming from there either.

Well now I know the details. I can proudly admit that I wasn't around during the Carter era .

 

[MoparMan]

'Plans' don't mean squat. Ceberus is, just now, laying down new strategies towards getting a return from their investment. If you think there's better than a 60% chance those current next Gen Viper 'plans' will continue -- all the way to production -- well, that could be the sad mistake if you hold off and wait for that Gen5.

And that's just looking at the financial issues. Auto makers are, only now, getting serious about the changes needed to address $100 oil. Need a preview? Go back and look at one of those book store car books with all the cars from over the years ... take a look at how the cars changed from the early 70s, after the gas crisis (which permanently raised gas prices, similar to today) and check out some of those hot, high-performance '75 and '76 models ...

I truly, but sadly, believe that the only thing that will save the Viper is if Chrysler gets VERY serious with the car in racing -- on TV and in pictures on posters and magazines everywhere ... it was only the demand created from that established, unique, pure-racing image that saved Porsche back in the late 1970s (something that brand needs to get back to, by the way), while other sports cars faded.

I don't want to be negative, but I won't whistle in the dark either.

You're forgetting that in the auto industry production planning and development is initiated several years before introduction of said product. It's reasonable to assume that the ZC platform is scheduled for 2010, which is now not that far out. This implies that quite a lot of engineering effort has already been complete on this project. At a certain point they will reach a point of no return where so much has been invested in the project that terminating it becomes foolhardy. I'm not saying for sure they are already beyond that point, but I'm guessing they are very near it, at the least.

Furthermore, the Viper has been under threat of cancellation several times, probably more than anyone here realizes. Each time it has survived because those making the decisions have come to realize that the value of the Viper lies in more than just the profit per car sold. In fact, the promotional value of the car for the company as a whole must be taken into account. Those at Cerberus are smart enough to realize that they need the image and promotion that the Viper brings to the company.

I don't need a preview of the impact the early '70's oil crisis had on the American automobile - I was there. However, you're forgetting that impact was largely seen on those market segments that had broad sales. In other words, the cars that the regular Joes could afford. These cars changed in part because the folks buying them were being severely impacted by the cost of fuel and insurance (in the case of muscle cars). The Viper is in a completely different segment of the market. Those buying Vipers new typically have enough income such that increases in the price of gas do not affect their choice of vehicle.

I'm not, and never said I was, waiting for a Gen V, I've got a Gen II and a Gen III and after hearing the glowing reviews of the Gen IV am already starting to consider the purchase of one. BTW: I do think there's a better than 60% chance the ZC will get produced.

 

[Bobpantax]

1. " just adding a paxton will not make your '06 comparable - except for engine power - with questionable reliability - as compared to the normally aspirated '08." I have had a stock Paxton application on my 2006 coupe since I received the car from Woodhouse on May 11/2006. I now have a bit over 9000 miles on the car. It has been completely reliable in all contexts - traffic, highway, 100MPH plus ( in a safe an lawful environment) and at all temperature ranges. It remains to be seen whether the 2008 with VVT, cam within a cam, and complex Venom programming equals the relaiability I have experienced with my Woodhouse modified and prepared 2006 Coupe. I should add for clarification purposes that my car was inspected by Herb Helbig at CAAP and autographed on the plenum and the owner's manual was autographed by Mr. Sjoberg, father of the Viper. So, maybe I rceived an exceptional snake.

2. Whether the Viper continues depends, in part, on whether SRT continues as it has previously been formulated. Something must be happening because the Viper has not been at all auto shows and I have not yet seen any ads for the Viper in the print media. This does not mean that the Viper is being abandoned. I am merely suggesting that something must be happening internally with respect to SRT marketing and, perhaps, SRT itself.

3. With respect to the next generation, ZC, Viper, until new contracts are given to vendors for parts, it could be called off at a minimal cost in the overall corporate scheme of things. Let's face it. The entire cost of the Viper is a pimple on an elephant's tuchus from Chrysler LLC's point of view. Once again, I know nothing that would lead me to believe a cancellation is in the works.

 

[Yellow32]

....The new private equity owner is hurting BAD financially. Berry, berry, bad. In addition to Chrysler, they are also the recent new proud owners of 51% of GMAC, with all of it's sub-prime-slime. And they just backed out of the take-over bidding for Northern Rock. All of this = = No more 'wads of capital' for the Viper for a long time, if ever.

I did a little research, here is what I found:

Chrysler owner Cerberus may tap Daimler's 1.05 bln usd loan - report
NOV 21 2007

Chrysler owner Cerberus may tap Daimler's 1.05 bln usd loan - report - Forbes.com

FRANKFURT (Thomson Financial) - Cerberus may soon have to tap into the 1.05 bln usd loan facility Daimler AG promised to provide as part of a deal to sell the latter's 80.1 pct stake in US carmaker Chrysler, Financial Times Deutschland said, citing sources in the US.
Slow demand for the bonds that the company is issuing to finance in part the Chrysler acquisition is the reason Cerberus may call on the lending facility.

The report said the investment banks that were given the mandate to place the 4 bln eur of Chrysler bonds have delayed the process because of a lack of interest. The deadline for submission of interest to buy the bonds was last Monday, the report said.
A Daimler spokesman told the newspaper Cerberus has not yet asked to be given the loans but it would have no problems releasing the amount if it were to do so because of the carmaker's 'good liquidity'.

Daimler announced in August it agreed to take on 1.5 bln usd worth of debt to help finance Cerberus's takeover of Chrysler to help offset the impact of the 'highly volatile' US loan market.

[email protected]

 

[Disturbed]

I hope they get that ZC out with the TT-V10 in the works.