Track testing for Motor Trend again. Kinda secret. All the new Vipers. Rock on.

[Solid Red 98]

Did anyone notice the relatively small difference in curb weight between the SRT and GTS models in this test? The SRT weighed in at 3343 (no track pack) and the GTS weighed in at 3362 (no track pack either). That's only a difference of 19lbs vs. the 77lbs weight difference originally listed by SRT with weights 3354 for the non track pack SRT model and 3431 for the non track pack GTS. Nice to see both cars under the original numbers, and especially the GTS.

 

[Makara]

Did anyone notice the relatively small difference in curb weight between the SRT and GTS models in this test? The SRT weighed in at 3343 (no track pack) and the GTS weighed in at 3362 (no track pack either). That's only a difference of 19lbs vs. the 77lbs weight difference originally listed by SRT with weights 3354 for the non track pack SRT model and 3431 for the non track pack GTS. Nice to see both cars under the original numbers, and especially the GTS.

Ummmmmmm.... the GTS had the track pack. "We took a look at the telemetry and the difference, it seems, was actually in the brakes. The GTS was equipped with the optional Track Package, which among other things upgrades the brakes with lighter, slotted, two-piece, StopTech rotors."

 

[SnakeBitten]

Did anyone notice the relatively small difference in curb weight between the SRT and GTS models in this test? The SRT weighed in at 3343 (no track pack) and the GTS weighed in at 3362 (no track pack either). That's only a difference of 19lbs vs. the 77lbs weight difference originally listed by SRT with weights 3354 for the non track pack SRT model and 3431 for the non track pack GTS. Nice to see both cars under the original numbers, and especially the GTS.

Remember a while back that Ralph had tweeted that the cars were coming in much lighter than expected. This was in response to someone asking him why the cars had such a high ride height. So Im not surprised they are much lighter than originally stated. This bodes well for a 3200lb or less ACR model

One other thing. Im not sure if the Gen V vert will be like the Gen III/IV in being lighter than the coupe models. But if its built similarly the Viper vert may be around the same or less weight as the GTS. They did a good job shaving 100+ lbs across the board over the previous models. I hope they really get a bit more extreme in the weight saving with the upcoming ACR.

 

[mnc2886]

Remember a while back that Ralph had tweeted that the cars were coming in much lighter than expected. This was in response to someone asking him why the cars had such a high ride height. So Im not surprised they are much lighter than originally stated. This bodes well for a 3200lb or less ACR model

One other thing. Im not sure if the Gen V vert will be like the Gen III/IV in being lighter than the coupe models. But if its built similarly the Viper vert may be around the same or less weight as the GTS. They did a good job shaving 100+ lbs across the board over the previous models. I hope they really get a bit more extreme in the weight saving with the upcoming ACR.

Following with the semi European theme, I expect the ACR to drop 220 lbs or 100 kgs. I'm only hoping though...

 

[Boxer12]

140 less weight ACR? If the Gen V is like previous models, you can lose a bunch of weight with a race exhaust, race battery and race seat (delete passenger), as well as removing the sound system and carpets. I would say 100 lbs off the stock weight is doable for any of these cars but I don't see SRT putting a race exhaust, or race battery in the ACR. All the body panels are already CF, so where are they going to shave 140#? Will take some real magic to get to 3200#.

 

[ViperSmith]

lighter materials inside (dash) and lighter seats would save some decent weight, imo

where else? well who knows LOL

 

[Alabaster Mamba]

Now, can the Gen V be ordered with the aero equipment that was shown at SEMA? If so, then why hasn't the Gen V been tested with those additions to show how well they improve performance? If these items are able to be ordered from the factory, then any times the Gen V makes with these items can be compared as a stock vs stock comparison. This car is turning out to be very impressive indeed.

SRT: Give people the option to include better pads, better fluids from the factory and you have improved the product even more and still retained a factory optioned vehicle.

 

[Solid Red 98]

Ummmmmmm.... the GTS had the track pack. "We took a look at the telemetry and the difference, it seems, was actually in the brakes. The GTS was equipped with the optional Track Package, which among other things upgrades the brakes with lighter, slotted, two-piece, StopTech rotors."

Interesting. Looking at the pictures it does appear the GTS had the slotted rotors. I was thrown off by the heavier six spoke venom wheels that appear to be mounted on the GTS and it seemed as though the article was stating as though the GTS was not equipped with the track pack. So with the sidewinder 11 wheels we would see an even lower weight for the GTS.

 

[VENOM V]

Interesting. Looking at the pictures it does appear the GTS had the slotted rotors. I was thrown off by the heavier six spoke venom wheels that appear to be mounted on the GTS and it seemed as though the article was stating as though the GTS was not equipped with the track pack. So with the sidewinder 11 wheels we would see an even lower weight for the GTS.

Yes, over 20 pounds lighter for a set of Sidewinder II's, compared to the Venoms. Viper Parts of America weighed them.

 

[Makara]

Interesting. Looking at the pictures it does appear the GTS had the slotted rotors. I was thrown off by the heavier six spoke venom wheels that appear to be mounted on the GTS and it seemed as though the article was stating as though the GTS was not equipped with the track pack. So with the sidewinder 11 wheels we would see an even lower weight for the GTS.

I'm guessing that the extra tires that were tested were mounted on the venom wheels. It is quite possible that photo cars were not the same as the tested cars or wheels swapped for the photo shoot. The car was clearly stated to have come with the track pack in the text. Aside from that, aren't most dimensional stats on a vehicle provided by the manufacturer? I wouldn't get too overboard with hoping that car is even lighter than the article states.

 

[Solid Red 98]

Agreed. And besides, we are talking about 20-50 lbs difference here, which the driver his or herself could make.

 

[I Bin Therbefor]

Seems that initial mods S/B focused on the tires, brakes and suspension tuning in that sequence?

 

[I Bin Therbefor]

Agreed. And besides, we are talking about 20-50 lbs difference here, which the driver his or herself could make.

The wheel weight is unsprung weight and that has an impact on the handling far beyond the weight reduction.

As has been previously mentioned, it seems like mag shocks may well be an interesting option as well as ceramic brakes.

 

[chorps]

Good article, it seemed fair to me. A few items that caught my eye:

The production GTS and SRT on standard P Zeros beat the pre-production GTS on Corsas- cool!

Here are some of the faster laps turned at Laguna Seca, combining this test with Motor Trend's top 10 fastest and the 1:33.99 that the ACR turned:

1. 1:33.70 ZR1 Corvette
2. 1:33.99 Gen IV Viper ACR
3. 1:34.23 Gen V Viper GTS
4. 1:34.43 Z06/Z07 Corvette
5. 1:34.50 McClaren MP4-12C
6. 1:34.63 Gen V Viper SRT

God Bless America, as Randy says!

Now as others have said, slap some real tires on the Gen V and take the #1 spot!

Well I guess this sheds new light on the discussion that the Gen V was going to be as fast as the Gen IV ACR. Being 1/4 second off shows that the new car is definitely in the hunt. A couple of more tweaks and it will be right up there.

 

[Makara]

Well I guess this sheds new light on the discussion that the Gen V was going to be as fast as the Gen IV ACR. Being 1/4 second off shows that the new car is definitely in the hunt. A couple of more tweaks and it will be right up there.

Unfortunately, it isn't quite in the hunt for the old vette yet. Well, it edged by the much cheaper one...

I don't like that at all.

 

[ACRucrazy]

Unfortunately, it isn't quite in the hunt for the old vette yet. Well, it edged by the much cheaper one...

I don't like that at all.

The ZO6 was optioned up to over $100,000.

Also the Gen V with MPCS tires would beat a Gen IV ACR I bet.

 

[Makara]

The ZO6 was optioned up to over $100,000.

Also the Gen V with MPCS tires would beat a Gen IV ACR I bet.

I just went to the MT site to see what options the car had and if any of them were non-performance. While I was doing that, I noticed something rather interesting: the car is listed as z06 with a zero rather than zo6. Oddly enough, the zero spelling came up on more sites when google searching. I had read that the ZO stood for "Zora" and it was indeed a letter and not a number. Am I wrong in that?

Either way, the vette was just a tad over 100k. I didn't find what it's options were but there is a good chance that they were not all performance options. That is splitting hairs anyway. The fact of the matter is, I love the viper, I love that it decimated cars that cost so much more when it came out, I love that every one that I have owned is bucket loads of fun, I love that despite the fact that I hardly see others on the road (despite the fact that there is another on my small street in the hills), but I don't like them having performance numbers that are within reach of vettes which I see at every stop light.

As far as the Gen V keeping up with the MPCS tires, that doesn't quite work. I'm not sure that they make them in the right size at the moment but more than that, they don't come from the factory with them. Remember when the vette guys were using that excuse, that the the ZR1 would keep up or beat the viper with the same tires and we threw it in their faces that showroom stock is showroom stock? Well, now we are the excuse makers.

 

[Boxer12]

I have to read the article again, but I don't recall them saying if they used TC or not to get fastest times...I presume "NO" with Probst at the wheel. As for the new car faster than the ACR, it does have 40 added ponies, suspension upgrades, lighter weight, better aerodynamics, etc. It should be very competitive with the aero package, if not faster. Ralph said the new Viper should be about 2 sec a mile faster than old Viper on the track, so that puts it about where the ACR stood to the SRT10. Right? Deduct another 2 sec for the new ACR and then you have a car that will beat the ZR1 hands down.

 

[VENOM V]

I just went to the MT site to see what options the car had and if any of them were non-performance. While I was doing that, I noticed something rather interesting: the car is listed as z06 with a zero rather than zo6. Oddly enough, the zero spelling came up on more sites when google searching. I had read that the ZO stood for "Zora" and it was indeed a letter and not a number. Am I wrong in that?

Either way, the vette was just a tad over 100k. I didn't find what it's options were but there is a good chance that they were not all performance options. That is splitting hairs anyway. The fact of the matter is, I love the viper, I love that it decimated cars that cost so much more when it came out, I love that every one that I have owned is bucket loads of fun, I love that despite the fact that I hardly see others on the road (despite the fact that there is another on my small street in the hills), but I don't like them having performance numbers that are within reach of vettes which I see at every stop light.

As far as the Gen V keeping up with the MPCS tires, that doesn't quite work. I'm not sure that they make them in the right size at the moment but more than that, they don't come from the factory with them. Remember when the vette guys were using that excuse, that the the ZR1 would keep up or beat the viper with the same tires and we threw it in their faces that showroom stock is showroom stock? Well, now we are the excuse makers.

I think you are splitting hairs. If you have to have the fastest showroom stock car, then be prepared to buy a new car each year. Not many can afford that. I understand your point that the Viper dominated at one point, but before that it was another car, and before that,...

10 years from now, I will still be enjoying my snake on weekend getaways with my lady, and I will be tracking it with my friends, enjoying the experience regardless of who's got the latest-greatest supercar that may be turning faster times than me.

Enjoy the journey.

 

[ViperSmith]

^^ I see it as that and BFD anyway. So what it is .53 seconds behind the record at Laguna Seca. It is SCREAMING fast. It only matters to the people that care about facts and figures.

The fact is, the Viper (And ZR1) will far outperform almost everyone on this site. Enjoy what it gives you. I'll never, ever, ever be able to reach its potentials

The 60/70's may have been the "Muscle" car era, but we are by far in the super car era right now. The fact you can buy a world class dominating car like this for $100k is unreal. This isn't 1992 anymore where the Viper came out of no where and dominated a boring market.

We live in the awesome world of Pagani, Koenisisisisiisigigigg, the GT-R (love or hate), McLaren, etc. It is an awesome time for stupidly fast, fun, beautiful cars. And Lamborghini's aren't complete piles of overpriced **** anymore - they are world class machines.

If anything, we all should be pretty amazed that a shoe string budget SRT had was able to get within .53 of the new record set by a ZR1, possibly one of the most well funded car programs out there.

Now, if SRT every delivers the car anytime soon - thats another matter.

 

[SnakeBitten]

140 less weight ACR? If the Gen V is like previous models, you can lose a bunch of weight with a race exhaust, race battery and race seat (delete passenger), as well as removing the sound system and carpets. I would say 100 lbs off the stock weight is doable for any of these cars but I don't see SRT putting a race exhaust, or race battery in the ACR. All the body panels are already CF, so where are they going to shave 140#? Will take some real magic to get to 3200#.

I hear you. Until SRT proves how serious they are with the next ACR we can only speculate. However I remember about 2 or so years ago Ralph himself said the upcoming ACR would be wild and radical compared to the then current ACR which still is a serious machine. So with that statement in mind Id expect the next ACR to come in under 3200lbs or at least around there.

Take the 25k in equipment that makes a GTS more expensive than the SRT, the money for the 20k paint job and 8k leather interior and put it towards the above list for the ACR. A little oversimplified since they obviously have internal protocols but its doable if they get the right people in that boardroom. Of course then those in the market for one will have to worry about that "wild and radical" price lol.

 

[SnakeBitten]

I had read that the ZO stood for "Zora" and it was indeed a letter and not a number. Am I wrong in that?

Remember when the vette guys were using that excuse, that the the ZR1 would keep up or beat the viper with the same tires and we threw it in their faces that showroom stock is showroom stock? Well, now we are the excuse makers.

Yes I read that it stood for Zora as well so Im confused as to how it became a zero instead of a the letter O. Oh well...

EDIT: From Corvette forum. Looks like we both read wrong info on the name.

"That's an RPO Zora and his team came up with as a special performance package in '63. RPO = Regular Production Option. Like the Z28 RPO, it doesn't stand for anything specific - it's the alphanumeric designation that becomes a moniker due to the popularity of the model."

I agree with you completely about the showroom stock thing. The ZR1 has bragging rights for now on that front period.

The Viper will get comparable rubber soon judging by Ralphs lastest tweets about the Viper being just .5 behind on its rain tires. I think the Viper guys have more of a legit claim to say that on equal tires it will dominate the ZR1. Its not even a full second off the MPSC ZR1 whereas at the time, when the Vette guys were positing about equal tires thing, the Viper was more than 4 secs ahead of the ZR1 at the Ring. I can just imagine the time a Gen V will run with comparable tires. Its not far off the old ACR time either.

I can swallow the .5 deficit but couldn't stomach the 2+ second beatdown. It didnt win the second go round but the car is obviously a beast even on its dress shoes. I cant wait till it puts on its running shoes.

 

[VENOM V]

It didnt win the second go round but the car is obviously a beast even on its dress shoes. I cant wait till it puts on its running shoes.

Haha, well said!

 

[v10enomous]

It's a Zero...

http://www.chevrolet.com/corvette-z06-sports-car/build-your-own.html?x-zipcode=20146

 

[Stealth]

First, a well-equiped Z06 is available for significantly below $100k.

Second, while SRT has accomplished alot, it still has a lot of work to do to stay at or near the top in perrmance. There is a new ZR1 and Z06 on the way which will no doubt be superior to the old cars. Most Viper buyers DO care about the performance of the Viper vs. other performance cars--especially GM, Ford, Porsche, BMW, Mercedes and even Ferrari and Lambo. I for one really hope SRT reaches high and scores again!

 

[ACRucrazy]

As far as the Gen V keeping up with the MPCS tires, that doesn't quite work. I'm not sure that they make them in the right size at the moment but more than that, they don't come from the factory with them. Remember when the vette guys were using that excuse, that the the ZR1 would keep up or beat the viper with the same tires and we threw it in their faces that showroom stock is showroom stock? Well, now we are the excuse makers.

I am not making an excuse about the ZR1. It is what it is.
My comment was more directed at the Gen IV ACR being faster than the Gen V. If a Gen V with lesser performing tires than the ACR is only .24 seconds or whatever behind at LS, in my mind the same driver with both car on the same tires I believe the Gen V would beat the outgoing ACR.

I was more or less praising the Gen V. I really love this car. I wish I could afford one. Until then, I will continue to enjoy my '08 Aero Coupe

 

[kdaviper]

First, a well-equiped Z06 is available for significantly below $100k.

Second, while SRT has accomplished alot, it still has a lot of work to do to stay at or near the top in perrmance. There is a new ZR1 and Z06 on the way which will no doubt be superior to the old cars. Most Viper buyers DO care about the performance of the Viper vs. other performance cars--especially GM, Ford, Porsche, BMW, Mercedes and even Ferrari and Lambo. I for one really hope SRT reaches high and scores again!

yeah and a well-equipped mustang is 60k.... I'm sure if anybody on this thread wanted a z06, they would have one, or two.

 

[Stealth]

yeah and a well-equipped mustang is 60k.... I'm sure if anybody on this thread wanted a z06, they would have one, or two.

I had a C6 Z06 and sold it when I purchased by Gen IV Viper new.

 

[Coloviper]

Funny how there are those that feel the future Z07 and ZR1 are going to be vastly superior to the outgoing generation. GEN V has a lot of growing and dialing in still to do to best the outgoing GEN IV ACR. Why would Chevy all of a sudden be so vastly different on their end? All these car companies have new regs, management, etc. that throw hooks into all this fun stuff and Chevy is absolutely no different. Past performance does not guarantee future performance. There is zero guarantee of superior future Chevy performance out of the box. The cars actually built are what they are, period. All this future predicting is childish. You might as well be in the sand box talking about real world performance of Hot Wheels.

The good take away from this thread is SRT has made some serious strides in a VERY short time period around Laguna Sega and they are not done yet. There is zero doubt that the properly equiped new GTS will not continue to just get better and better. However the Z07 and ZR1 are NOT the only cars the Viper needs to worry about. They are all striding for the top of the mountain.

SRT has to keep working on it and they are, so that should be encouragement enough. The great thing with the Viper is you do not need to drive around with a paperbag with eye cut outs over your head like in the new Vette. Fast, slow, etc. that new Vette is down right ugly from every single angle. If that is your fancy though, it will look great next to your Pontiac Aztek in the garage though.

 

[ViperSmith]

Also consider the ZR1 is at the top of its game, the Z06 is as well. They have been out for years and have been tweaked endlessly. The Viper came out and had an amazing showing.

After 4 years of tweaking, you can bet the Gen V will be even more of a monster.