mjorgensen Woodhouse
Enthusiast
Tell all your significant others that it will make a great Holiday gift! (about two weeks)
tunning 08
- Thread starter 08viperviolet
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Tell all your significant others that it will make a great Holiday gift! (about two weeks)
Flash1034
Enthusiast
Thanks. Roughly how much will it cost?
Thanks,
Flash
Thanks,
Flash
mjorgensen Woodhouse
Enthusiast
My "guess" based on the fact that the new Venom controller list for about $1300 stock would be $1500ish?
Flash1034
Enthusiast
Thanks for the info.
Flash
Flash
caseyse
Viper Owner
The new controller will likely provide more than the traditional Gen3 tune, as we could see added performance from different cam VVT
mjorgensen Woodhouse
Enthusiast
Can't guarantee the warranty issue because it is an aftermarket PCM for off road use only. This would generally be a red flag for most dealers if major failure occurs.
The new controller will likely provide more than the traditional Gen3 tune, as we could see added performance from different cam VVT
I'm pretty sure the gains will be less than the Gen 3 tunes gained. The SRT group did not really leave much on the table. The parameters will likely be a bit "looser" to accommodate mods without check engine lights. It will also enhance mods over the stock programming.
mjorgensen Woodhouse
Enthusiast
I had a mistype here and over looked it till now, I would be willing to bet $2500 is probably closer to the target. We should know in a couple weeks either way.
Let's hope that some of the foregoing information is not accurate. Minor gains for stock or exhaust-only cars, $2,500 and risk of a voided warranty do not sound too good. 
Especially when we have 600-620hp stock or with just exhaust.
The fact that SRT Engineers have said we start with a "highly-stressed engine" does not bode well for tuning either.
The C6Z was also a highly stressed engine. However, cold air and tuning was worth about 25-35 rwhp and rwtrq. Headers and high-flow cats added another 20rwhp and rwtrq. So who knows?
Since many considering tuning will also consider exhaust and headers, I will tell you that Corsas and STOCK CATS are great! Corsas and Metal high-flow CATS will get you arrested in 5 miles--like open exhaust or no exhaust. I went through $600 in on-off-on--off fees trying the different combinations. So if you are considering changing CATS and adding headers, definitely listen to a car that has this combo in person first.
good luck on your choices!
Especially when we have 600-620hp stock or with just exhaust.The fact that SRT Engineers have said we start with a "highly-stressed engine" does not bode well for tuning either.
The C6Z was also a highly stressed engine. However, cold air and tuning was worth about 25-35 rwhp and rwtrq. Headers and high-flow cats added another 20rwhp and rwtrq. So who knows?
Since many considering tuning will also consider exhaust and headers, I will tell you that Corsas and STOCK CATS are great! Corsas and Metal high-flow CATS will get you arrested in 5 miles--like open exhaust or no exhaust. I went through $600 in on-off-on--off fees trying the different combinations. So if you are considering changing CATS and adding headers, definitely listen to a car that has this combo in person first.
good luck on your choices!
mjorgensen Woodhouse
Enthusiast
The thing about the Mopar PCM is that it WILL allow more changes in tuning and not have check engine issues. The power will be the second benefit, the things turned off and the larger working parameters along with better throttle response will sell more than a few potential buyers I'm sure. The big plus is the SRT team did the programming so you KNOW they spent the time to get it right rather than someone else that will THINK they have it all figured out. Please do not dismiss this upgrade based on numbers alone no matter what they end up being because it is much more than that, SRT would not endorse something that will disappoint you all.
sonofadragracer
Enthusiast
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Thanks for the info Mark. Put me down on the list. ACR = ready!!
Andy
Andy
iron
Enthusiast
I read all the posts ... is it fair to say about 25 HP increase ... to about 625?
iron
Enthusiast
And out in a few weeks and at cost Mark stated earlier?
PS - I tried to delete above post and add this to it ... but I only see "edit" and no "delete" as part of "edit", nor "delete" by itself - sorry.
PS - I tried to delete above post and add this to it ... but I only see "edit" and no "delete" as part of "edit", nor "delete" by itself - sorry.
mjorgensen Woodhouse
Enthusiast
Should be about 10 days now and the gains will/should be a bit less than the 25 you suggest. The best parts of the PCM are stated above though so don't judge on power alone. Without this the ability to tune for any mods could be a long way off from other tuners so this is also part of what you are buying.
Thanks, I'm up to 16 now and if they all stay committed I will surely have a "deal" for you guys.
Thanks, I'm up to 16 now and if they all stay committed I will surely have a "deal" for you guys.
Grant
Viper Owner
Its tempting, but for $2,500 I'll go with a standalone. Provided Chrysler controls its throttle bodies and variable cams in the normal (PWM) fashion, it shouldn't too difficult (though moving to a more aggressive solid cam might be do-able too).
mjorgensen Woodhouse
Enthusiast
Maybe a stand alone will work for you, but for "most" owners this will be the best option. I bet you have $3K plus in hardware then a ton more $$$ to get all the tuning right so it works as well as the Mopar offering. The TB controls have been the major hiccup for many a tuner on the newer vehicles so I bet it won't be quite that simple, but I could be wrong.
More power, yeah, like that's really what the car needs. Pa-lease! As is ya can't put all the power to the ground, in a useful manner, in my stock 08. I don't know about anyone else but I can break 'em loose at 60mph.More power?! Maybe on a drag strip!
Malu59RT
Enthusiast
Grant
Viper Owner
I'm not disagreeing. I've coded microcontrollers used in automotive apps, so its not a big deal for me. Unfortunately, it sounds like anyone wanting to go FI or heads/cam on a Gen 4 is going to need a stand-alone
gb66gth, if you can make black marks on a straight from the time you turn out of a corner until the braking point of the next turn, then you have enough horsepower.
GREAT point esp in the cold weather the car is a monster
mjorgensen Woodhouse
Enthusiast
UPDATE,
I have just been able to run a PCM on a real world car and dyno it. Although I cannot share the results right yet I can tell you that it is a GREAT mod. The throttle response is improved a bunch, the power is more linear, and it pulls like a bigger beast!
I have also been suggested to that the price may be less than I was expecting in the end so I will let you know ASAP when they give me the green light!
Stay tuned... get it?... ha ha tuned
I have just been able to run a PCM on a real world car and dyno it. Although I cannot share the results right yet I can tell you that it is a GREAT mod.
The throttle response is improved a bunch, the power is more linear, and it pulls like a bigger beast! I have also been suggested to that the price may be less than I was expecting in the end so I will let you know ASAP when they give me the green light!Stay tuned... get it?... ha ha tuned
Malu59RT
Enthusiast
UPDATE,
I have just been able to run a PCM on a real world car and dyno it. Although I cannot share the results right yet I can tell you that it is a GREAT mod.
Stay tuned... get it?... ha ha tuned
Mark,
As far as tunability, I understand the need for the PCM. However, I believe the throttle response issue needs to be dealt with via a recall/TSB or something else. I should not have to drop $2,000 to get the throttle response my car should have come from the factory with.
mjorgensen Woodhouse
Enthusiast
I would be willing to bet the most improvement in the response comes from the improved tip in programming and A/F changes. This car pulls much harder and quicker than the stock cars whether an 08' or 09'. They have improved the overall tune to be much more aggressive feeling at the onset of acceleration if that makes sense. On top of that the car just pulls smoother like when the DC flashes are used on the gen3. The factory programming cannot achieve this within the emission standards I would suspect.
I see many posts complaining about the '08's throttle response but I for one don't mind it. It's much better than another car of mine that had a very sensitive tip-in which made throttle more difficult to modulate coming out tight corners in the lower gears. So does anyone have the stock throttle opening graph that they can share?
I am waiting for the new tune for my car, but I agree with Malu59RT we shouldn't have to spend money to fix the TBW issue. I know Herb said it was so they could have more onboard diagnostics but I don't remeber anyone saying thats what they wanted. In fact in all the tech talks I recall everyone wanting to keep the car simple.
SSGViper
Enthusiast
My thoughts EXACTLY!
CitySnake
Enthusiast
I'll add myself to this list. Part of that upgrade should be done as a recall. I might spend for the entire package and I don't care whether they parcel out the A/F HP upgrades or not, but the throttle response re-tune should be a free (to the customer) dealer recall.
I might add that I'm not particularly bothered with the existing tune and throttle response. After 3,000 miles, I've gotten comfortably used to the change. Regardless, it should be a free upgrade.
mjorgensen Woodhouse
Enthusiast
Alright I have been given the go ahead so here are the dyno sheets we got yesterday afternoon. These are stock 1400 mile ACR and the same car with the Mopar controller. Check out how much smoother the curve is and better the torque curve is through the range you drive the most. This is also the reason the thing is so much more powerful from a roll and at the tip in under the peak.
HP gains are pretty conservative but mostly increased within the torque areas. The added top end is from the extra 500 RPM allowed with the controller. I should have numbers Wed. with the Belanger headers and exhaust on this same car for you so... stay tuned... ha ha it never gets old...ha ha.
If you have any specific questions about these feel free to call me.
Thanks,
HP gains are pretty conservative but mostly increased within the torque areas. The added top end is from the extra 500 RPM allowed with the controller. I should have numbers Wed. with the Belanger headers and exhaust on this same car for you so... stay tuned... ha ha it never gets old...ha ha.
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If you have any specific questions about these feel free to call me.
Thanks,
doctorbob
Enthusiast
I want a piece of this free advertising and a big discount. I wonder who's ACR that is?
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