ZR1 FORUMS ARE

[Vic]

I'd rather have a Hefeweisen.

 

[lankhoss]

Mmmmmm, unfiltered beer

 

[black mamba1]

Car and Driver gave the nod to the Z06 in its test vs the 08 Viper. But they still said that parked next to the Viper, the Z06 in hardly noticeable.

End of story.

 

[Nine Ball]

Vipermann, are you sure you want to continue pretending to know what you are talking about in regards to GM engines? Hmmmm...

We've all read how GM says they went to the smaller 6.2L to keep the hood lines low with the blower, and other reasons too.

Guess what, the 427ci LS7 is externally the exact same size as the LS2, LS3, LS6 and even the same as a 346ci LS1. The LS7 just has larger diameter cylinders and a 4.00" stroker crank. On the outside, they are physically the same size, and about the same weight. These are small block 427ci engines, not big blocks from the 1960s. This is basic knowledge, and I'm happy to be the one to educate an expert like yourself on it.

But I, not unlike others, even some of the Vette faithful, will always believe that GM could have delivered even more performance for the money if they had built up the 7.0L (from the Z06) instead of a smaller 6.2L.

See explanation above, as well as what Lankhoss already mentioned. The engines (LS7 vs LS9) are physically the same size. That means the engine block is the size constraint. If you want to build a stronger forced induction engine, you need thicker cylinder walls. The only way to get thicker cylinder walls, as well as increased engine coolant passage sizing, is to reduce the cylinder sleeve diameter. Hence using a 6.2 with a smaller bore. The smaller engine with the supercharger will also produce less emissions than a larger sized all-motor combo producing the same power output.

Vipermann, I can tell by your posting style that you simply enjoy getting the last word. Please feel free to type up your bold highlighted (maybe use some colors too?) rebuttal and claim internet victory now. Consider it a gift from me, YOU can have the last word here! I'll just answer other people's questions and disregard yours.

(insert last word here for Vipermann, I've succumbed to his infinite performance guru-ism)

 

[Vipermann]

I can tell by your posting style that you simply enjoy getting the last word.

... No, that's more your thing. I'll only respond with the facts to clarify your lengthy attack on my using HP/L to describe the engine's output.

btw, where in my post did I say those engine blocks were of different sizes? show me. I only stated what I had recalled reading. Do I know everything there is to know about the LS? No, not even after modding my own LS1 in every way possible. I never claimed that. But thanks for your peacock display anyway (even though you were wrong about the HP/L point from the start, and have been changing the subject ever since)...

From the official ZR1 press release:

"To preserve forward visibility, the intercooler sends air from the top of the blower out sideways through separate cooling blocks for each bank."

And yes, they note the thinner walls of the LS7 as the primary reason for using a modified LS3 block ... but then GM goes on to use that ignorant and misleading HP/L measurement ... and wasn't that where this all started???

"The engine is based on a modified LS3 6.2-liter block (the LS7's cylinder walls are too thin to withstand boost) and is expected to produce 100 horsepower/liter." (620)

Nine Ball, maybe you should write a letter to GM and tell them how stupid and incomplete you feel that it is for the engineers at GM to use that HP/L measurement to describe the output of their engine ... that would help GM, coming from an expert like you.

 

[DR EVIL]

Stock LS7 heads will outflow even the Strikers, let alone stock Viper heads.

don't the new '08 heads flow about the same on the intake side as the LS7 heads and more on the exhaust?

I think I saw a post somewhere where the 08 heads flow ~340cfm at .600 which is close to the ~350cfm the LS7 heads flow. Although with 10 ports there is no contest in overall headflow.

 

[CitySnake]

Question: The Corvette ZR1 at around 100 grand is the only competition for this, right?

Herb Helbig: Let's be honest: the race has always been between us and Corvette--and it's been a beautiful thing. I mean, when you think about the magic of competition between guys like the Corvette guys and the Viper guys, we're really the same guys under the skin. I feel for them, because they've got more bureaucracy and more suits in their deal, so that's an advantage for us.

But covertly or not, it's always been about the Corvette and us. I mean, think about why the ZO6 ever came to be born. Why do you think the Blue Devil was ever conceived of? Because Bob Lutz said, "I don't want you to get your ass kicked by those guys over at Viper. Oh, by the way, they've been kicking your ass!" It's always been about that.

The Blue Devil guys are going to have to bring some pretty serious stuff to compete with this. And it's more than just sticking a supercharger on.

But those guys are like us. They're guys just like Mike and Matt and myself back there twiddlin' away, trying to figure out how to one-up us. And, you know, it doesn't get any better than that these days!

We've got to consider this car is an urban weapon, is what I like to call it. This is a serious piece of machinery, this is not just a grocery-getter.

 

[JohnnyLightning]

Huh?

Drifting started in Japan, years before anybody ever did it here in the US.

Competition types:

1/4 mile: Mostly car/motor, with quick reaction time, but really no balls required, unless you're going 200mph.

Drifting: Much harder than it looks, mostly driver skill, but no balls required unless you're worried about wrecking your car.

Track: Car means a lot, so does driver skill, and takes more balls than any of the other forms of competition (as you downshift at the end of the back straight a Sebring and look at that concrete wall). Also, the most fans -- it actually gets TV coverage and real paid sponsors ... much more so than 1/4 mi drag racing.

Sorry Vipermann but I know Nine Ball has been busting your balls but your an idiot.... but I am afraid everytime I click on the channel on saturday afternoon drag racing is on ESPN...Now and then on the speed channel they have track racing which mostly is from over seas...I am afraid drag racing has more publicity in the US...Take a look down low ask these people does it take bigger balls to do this or drive on a track....

7.190* 185.780 4.560 149.750 1.010 Dodge Viper Jerry Bickel 2002 Ron Siegal
2) 7.788* 169.000 5.000 138.000 1.135 Dodge Viper GTS 1998 Chris Orthodoxou
3) 7.996*+ 177.060 5.234 141.860 1.306 Dodge Viper Heffner Twin Turbo 2001 Chad
4) 8.540* 174.000 5.660 136.000 1.450 Dodge Viper Stryker TTRS 1996 Ron Misjak Jr. (SVS)
5) 8.751*+ 163.420 5.726 129.720 1.363 Dodge Viper Heffner Twin Turbo GTS 2002 Gary Javo
6) 8.780*+ 154.100 5.720 123.650 1.340 Dodge Viper GTS 1996 T. Darwin
7) 9.160* 154.320 5.900 120.900 1.370 Dodge Viper GTS 1996 Ron Misjak Jr. (SVS)
8) 9.450 157.000 121.000 1.520 Dodge Viper GTS 2001 jeff keisner
9) 9.456*+ 152.000 Dodge Viper gts 2001 albert (RSI Rohn)
10) 9.480* 145.220 6.224 115.110 1.428 Dodge Viper RT 10 1999 BIG GUN -SCOTT WIECK

 

[Vipermann]

...everytime I click on the channel on saturday afternoon drag racing is on ESPN...Now and then on the speed channel they have track racing which mostly is from over seas...I am afraid drag racing has more publicity in the US...Take a look down low ask these people does it take bigger balls to do this or drive on a track....

7.190* 185.780 4.560 149.750 1.010 Dodge Viper Jerry Bickel 2002 Ron Siegal
2) 7.788* 169.000 5.000 138.000 1.135 Dodge Viper GTS 1998 Chris Orthodoxou
3) 7.996*+ 177.060 5.234 141.860 1.306 Dodge Viper Heffner Twin Turbo 2001 Chad
4) 8.540* 174.000 5.660 136.000 1.450 Dodge Viper Stryker TTRS 1996 Ron Misjak Jr. (SVS)
5) 8.751*+ 163.420 5.726 129.720 1.363 Dodge Viper Heffner Twin Turbo GTS 2002 Gary Javo
6) 8.780*+ 154.100 5.720 123.650 1.340 Dodge Viper GTS 1996 T. Darwin
7) 9.160* 154.320 5.900 120.900 1.370 Dodge Viper GTS 1996 Ron Misjak Jr. (SVS)
8) 9.450 157.000 121.000 1.520 Dodge Viper GTS 2001 jeff keisner
9) 9.456*+ 152.000 Dodge Viper gts 2001 albert (RSI Rohn)
10) 9.480* 145.220 6.224 115.110 1.428 Dodge Viper RT 10 1999 BIG GUN -SCOTT WIECK

145 - 185 mph is plenty fast ... true. Now, just imagine those speeds with a 90 degree turn at the end of the straight (and other cars around you) ...

As for sport popularity, well, I've sponsored NASCAR teams, and CART teams, and I can tell you that sport popularity (audience size) dictates where and how much sponsorship money flows ... drag racing teams (or events) are comparatively cheaper to sponsor. That's how it is.

 

[JohnnyLightning]

145 - 185 mph is plenty fast ... true. Now, just imagine those speeds with a 90 degree turn at the end of the straight (and other cars around you) ...

As for sport popularity, well, I've sponsored NASCAR teams, and CART teams, and I can tell you that sport popularity (audience size) dictates where and how much sponsorship money flows ... drag racing teams (or events) are comparatively cheaper to sponsor. That's how it is.

I know NASCAR but it mostly OVAL...The track races has the least audience....I practically live between Charlotte, Bristol & Darlington....Miss Rockingham....Of course they have crowds but the track events don't bring much....Driving those speeds with a 90 degree turn at the end no problem do that every weekend at least twice all I can say is this both involve balls and I can't wait until the ACR, ZR1 & GTR have a comparison....No doubt being a Viper owner I am pulling for the ACR but what my boys around the shop say wait until the GTR hits the floor because for performance it's a bargain even though it's ugly...

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

Well first of all I think tracking is like drifting to be honest nothing like in the south pulling up to a light and going from a dead stop to a quarter mile the fastest....If I was going to by a track car no offense but I would buy the Nissan GTR because I promise you it will out due both the ACR & ZR1 there....

People like Underground racing, heffner etc....are into fastest quarter mile not because my civic can out turn your civic kind of crap....

Please, if you wanna go faster on a dragstrip then just write a bigger check. (pros excluded)

But if you wanna go faster on a real track (as in road course), then there is no other around it, you gotta put some time in. It won't matter if you have a GTR, ACR, ZR1 or FXX if you don't have the experience.